Re: [102attendees] Visa problems - need a different invitation letter

Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de> Tue, 11 September 2018 18:42 UTC

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Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2018 20:42:46 +0200
From: Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de>
To: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>
Cc: "Sterne, Jason (Nokia - CA/Ottawa)" <jason.sterne@nokia.com>, 103attendees@ietf.org, 102attendees <102attendees@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [102attendees] Visa problems - need a different invitation letter
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What type of interactions do the folks setting up IETF meetings have
with local authorities about this ? Why is it not possible to ask:

What is the best written guidance for attendees to our conference
whether or not your countries Visa Waiver program is sufficient to enter
the country if one is attending our conference ?

Since i raised this question firt before argentina, i have seen no one
from the meetings committee or the like provide any answer to this
question.

Cheers
    Toerless

On Tue, Sep 11, 2018 at 02:06:25PM -0400, John C Klensin wrote:
> 
> 
> --On Tuesday, September 11, 2018 16:56 +0000 "Sterne, Jason
> (Nokia - CA/Ottawa)" <jason.sterne@nokia.com> wrote:
> 
> >...
> > Everyone has their own circumstances, but it is really a shame
> > that we (IETF as an organization) can't get a definitive
> > statement from the Thai authorities (i.e. in writing that we
> > can all print & bring) that attending this conference is not
> > considered as "business" by Thailand.  That would save a lot
> > of grief (and same was true for Buenos Aires and will be true
> > for many future IETFs).
> 
> First of all, this is not really about Thailand but about
> general practices.  Your comments about Argentina reinforce
> that.  Second, it could be "business" for some of us and not for
> others, so, in the case of some countries and circumstances, the
> answer may not be that the meeting is or is not "business" for
> all participants.
> 
> It may well be a shame, and probably is, but the only times I'm
> aware of getting that sort of guarantee (or clear and binding
> statement) from a government (at least a government that has not
> established a visa category for "standards body meeting" or
> equivalent) is when the government is actually a sponsor of the
> meeting.   There may well be exceptions (my experience is
> definitely not comprehensive) but, by and large, what people
> have been experiencing is fairly normal.   And, for whatever it
> worth, there are actually reasons for it that, from the
> perspective of the government, provide motivation to behave
> exactly the way people, especially local consulates, are
> behaving.  Those reasons go well beyond lack of motivation even
> though, in some cases, that might be part of the picture too. 
> 
> Get the best information you can about your situation and people
> holding passports (or other travel documents) from your country,
> act as conservatively about it as you think appropriate, and
> then go for it, hoping for the best and making whatever
> contingency plans you think appropriate.  
> 
> If you need guarantees, especially guarantees you can enforce,
> you are probably better off participating remotely.
> 
>    john
> 
> 
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