Re: [6lowapp] [6lowpan] hardware trends, new vs. existing protocols [Re: 4861 usage in LLNs]

Richard Kelsey <richard.kelsey@ember.com> Tue, 10 November 2009 17:25 UTC

Return-Path: <richard.kelsey@ember.com>
X-Original-To: 6lowapp@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: 6lowapp@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0027C3A68AD; Tue, 10 Nov 2009 09:25:46 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.515
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.515 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.084, BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HMpH1kqbcCx9; Tue, 10 Nov 2009 09:25:45 -0800 (PST)
Received: from EMPIRE.hq.ember.com (mail.ember.com [74.10.175.227]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13BB03A6B44; Tue, 10 Nov 2009 09:25:44 -0800 (PST)
Received: from kelsey-ws.hq.ember.com ([192.168.81.60]) by EMPIRE.hq.ember.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:27:37 -0500
Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:22:58 -0500
Message-Id: <87639il2fh.fsf@kelsey-ws.hq.ember.com>
To: Kris Pister <pister@eecs.berkeley.edu>
In-reply-to: <4AF90433.30204@eecs.berkeley.edu> (message from Kris Pister on Mon, 09 Nov 2009 22:12:03 -0800)
From: Richard Kelsey <richard.kelsey@ember.com>
References: <87y6mfwbfk.fsf@kelsey-ws.hq.ember.com> <1257809361.11184.123.camel@dellx1> <BCFFD6A3-8B4F-49CF-A657-DE34485134E1@tzi.org> <4AF8C20C.3070905@eecs.berkeley.edu> <9256B623-E13C-4EB3-9DE9-F850F2E828AC@tzi.org> <6B8DDEBE-5550-4795-81E0-DC137114EF83@archrock.com> <4AF8D5A0.1020600@eecs.berkeley.edu> <05C6A38D732F1144A8C4016BA4416BFE0242D3B1@SPO-EXVS-02.itron.com> <4AF90433.30204@eecs.berkeley.edu>
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Nov 2009 17:27:37.0539 (UTC) FILETIME=[18F64930:01CA622B]
Cc: Michael.Stuber@itron.com, 6lowpan@ietf.org, 6lowapp@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [6lowapp] [6lowpan] hardware trends, new vs. existing protocols [Re: 4861 usage in LLNs]
X-BeenThere: 6lowapp@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Application protocols for constrained nodes and networks <6lowapp.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowapp>, <mailto:6lowapp-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/6lowapp>
List-Post: <mailto:6lowapp@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:6lowapp-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/6lowapp>, <mailto:6lowapp-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Nov 2009 17:25:46 -0000

   Date: Mon, 09 Nov 2009 22:12:03 -0800
   From: Kris Pister <pister@eecs.berkeley.edu>

    > Abandoning the installed base just goes to reinforce the idea
    > that IP isn't an appropriate technology for things.

   Michael - I think that we have the same goal, but I disagree with that 
   statement.  I think that re-writing every protocol from discovery 
   through transport to applications, from scratch, is what reinforces the 
   idea that IP isn't an appropriate technology for things.

   I realize that there are pressures from an installed base, but at this 
   point it's a tiny fraction of the overall potential.  If we let the 1% 
   installed base dictate the path for the next 99%, we should do our best 
   to ensure that it's the right path.

Taking these two paragraphs together, you seem to be saying
that IP is an appropriate technology for tomorrow's things,
but not necessarily for today's.  While the hardware will
obviously improve over time, we still need to pick some
target platform.  The current 6lowpan charter gives 32K of
flash as an example and mentions 802.15.4 repeatedly.  Are
you suggesting that we recharter?  

The increasing capabilities of the hardware does give us the
reassuring prospect that the longer we take the solve the
problems the easier it will be to so.

                                -Richard Kelsey