Re: [73attendees] Is USA qualified for2.3ofdraft-palet-ietf-meeting-venue-selection-criteria?

Based on my knowledge, for Chinese citizens there is no any problem to get
the visa to other countries except US. 

  _____  

From: 73attendees-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:73attendees-bounces@ietf.org] On
Behalf Of David Quigley
Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2008 1:56 PM
To: Nicholas Weaver
Cc: 73attendees@ietf.org; ietf@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [73attendees] Is USA qualified
for2.3ofdraft-palet-ietf-meeting-venue-selection-criteria?

Disclaimer: What I say here are my words and don't represent the views of my
employer.

>From what I see here the issues are mostly experienced by Chinese citizens.
Most of the other countries have reciprocal visa agreements with the US.
China however doesn't have that agreement with Ireland, Sweden, Japan, or
the US. Were there similar problems with gaining entrance into Ireland? Will
there be similar issues with gaining entrance into Sweden or Japan?

Dave

On Tue, Nov 18, 2008 at 1:40 PM, Nicholas Weaver <nweaver@icsi.berkeley.edu>
wrote:

On Nov 18, 2008, at 10:53 AM, Scott Brim wrote:

Excerpts from Randy Bush on Tue, Nov 18, 2008 10:39:57AM -0600:

qdang@nist.gov wrote:

I believe our US government would like to grant visas to as many
people as they can. However, if anyone wants to attend a meeting in
the US is granted a visa to come here, then I can imagine there will
be 100 million visa applications for the IETF meeting in CA next year
alone.

thank you for demonstrating so clearly the jingoistic prejudice at the
us government level that should preclude ietf being held in the united
states.

How would you solve the problem?  Let 100 million people in on false
pretenses?  I'm not going to defend the behavior of the US government,
but I want you to admit that US immigration has a difficult problem.
Slinging labels around doesn't help.

Remember, the IETF is NOT special.  There are tens of thousands of
conferences, and they are all pretty much need-to-be-treated equal.  If the
US gave effectively carte blanch to conference attendees, you would have no
immigration controls, period, as this would be a big enough loophole to fly
an A380 through.

The Visa issue in the US is serious, but how many people are really affected
by this?

We need hard data, because the notion of simply "not holding IETF meetings
in a terrorist country" is not effective.

And if you want to do Visa issues as a criteria, you can strongly argue that
all IETF meeting SHOULD be in a country where a visa is not required for
travel for EU, US, Japanese, and Canadian citizens. 

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