Re: [87attendees] SIM purchase at the IETF (was Re: [87all] IETF 87 Berlin Meeting Review)

Bob Hinden <> Sun, 18 August 2013 15:33 UTC

Return-Path: <>
Received: from localhost (localhost []) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF38D11E8114 for <>; Sun, 18 Aug 2013 08:33:28 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -102.6
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, NO_RELAYS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from ([]) by localhost ( []) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K-CeowfjfmcI for <>; Sun, 18 Aug 2013 08:33:28 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ( [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c00::234]) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2FD611E80FA for <>; Sun, 18 Aug 2013 08:33:27 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by with SMTP id b13so2803035wgh.19 for <>; Sun, 18 Aug 2013 08:33:27 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;; s=20120113; h=content-type:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=GGuF0XwQw54vW0Ld5f4L528MMKOyCkvPuJVrFjuAmmM=; b=iSKiMhfq3M9jkL85x8moOmPrIH8lH3Zy45PMlaDzTlKfKbp2qY1wFWXjSVifjSh0l7 KTGzMmmtUBALzcyn4kwZM/RW8u8P58c4GVeW7PP2sg7vq3vCnKfFHPOs6ZZ1w+11gRSW Dpz9lz9zrqL/VFL9NJJvs2yDSbw+qYVUKRKO5KfsLs4k+2+b69TAQqF31mymc23umuje jYLrvCluYfwQhI63X7gOBljv952trhmWiSH944OTQt/Z/qAzMsNpnjss+AwWcYaQKwTW W91kLH+M7HhAig8/mQodEyYL9NFvjsg0UVw2137MwPOMYVQ7bQ0Y+o/zZply49o2dlvB 1zrw==
X-Received: by with SMTP id t3mr4951136wiw.24.1376840007064; Sun, 18 Aug 2013 08:33:27 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ?IPv6:2601:9:4080:10:d14b:f648:fc78:e882? ([2601:9:4080:10:d14b:f648:fc78:e882]) by with ESMTPSA id eb3sm10407239wic.10.1969. (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Sun, 18 Aug 2013 08:33:26 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.5 \(1508\))
From: Bob Hinden <>
In-Reply-To: <>
Date: Sun, 18 Aug 2013 08:33:19 -0700
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <>
References: <> <> <> <> <> <> <> <alpine.BSF.2.00.1308150927240.39997@joyce.lan> <> <alpine.BSF.2.00.1308151138170.40428@joyce.lan> <> <> <> <> <> <> <> <> <>
To: Mary Barnes <>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1508)
Cc: 87 attendees <>, Bob Hinden <>, Keith Moore <>
Subject: Re: [87attendees] SIM purchase at the IETF (was Re: [87all] IETF 87 Berlin Meeting Review)
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: <>
List-Unsubscribe: <>, <>
List-Archive: <>
List-Post: <>
List-Help: <>
List-Subscribe: <>, <>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 18 Aug 2013 15:33:29 -0000


Just to be clear, I was speaking for myself ("Personally").  I was not speaking for the IAOC.


On Aug 17, 2013, at 11:18 AM, Mary Barnes <> wrote:

> On Fri, Aug 16, 2013 at 12:51 PM, Bob Hinden <> wrote:
> Keith,
> On Aug 16, 2013, at 9:33 AM, Keith Moore <> wrote:
> > On Aug 16, 2013, at 11:57 AM, Dave Crocker <> wrote:
> >
> >>   The IAOC should pursue having a local SIM card rental booth at future IETF meetings.  The card choices should represent locally competitive costs and services.
> >
> > I never cease to be amazed at IETF participants' willingness to demand more and more free services from event organizers. 
> >
> > That said, I would certainly find it useful to have cheap SIM cards easily available, but probably only if accompanied by English language support.  It wouldn't necessarily have to be at the conference site.  A pointer to a nearby store or one at the local airport would probably be sufficient.
> Good points.
> Personally, I doubt the economics would make selling SIMs on site worthwhile for an SIM vendor.  What percentage of attendees would do buy a SIM (requires an unlocked phone, motivation, etc.)?   Would that generate enough revenue for the seller to have someone on site for a day or two?
> [MB] We don't have answers to these questions because we haven't tried it.  It would seem to be something easy to try in Vancouver since apparently there are several shops nearby. Asking one or two of those vendors to send someone to spend Sunday afternoon and Monday maybe wouldn't seem to be too much of a burden for them and if they aren't getting decent business, they can just leave. /MB] 
> If the IAOC took this on, it would map into asking the Secretariat to organize this, which would map into increased costs for all of us.
> [MB] So I guess your response is that this isn't something the IAOC is willing to consider despite the fact that there were several +1s that it might be helpful? I agree 100% that the secretariat already does a lot of work at IETF meetings.   And, we have continued to add to that burden over the years with newcomer's meet 'n greet, Bits 'n bytes, etc.  So, it would be good I think to evaluate the pros and cons before totally dismissing this suggestion.  Much in the same way that Bits 'n Bytes was started as a trial as it was deemed something that might benefit the community, I would think trying out this idea for one or two meetings is not unreasonable. [/MB]
> I think would be better to collect information on where to buy a SIM on the meeting Wiki.   We clearly have some experts on this topic in the IETF.
> [MB] That information would be helpful.  Some of the concerns raised, however, were around cases where the IETF attendees did not speak the local language While the usual response is that many people in European cities, for example, speak English, not all IETF participants have English as a first language.   So, while knowing where the shop is can be helpful, it doesn't solve the problem of being able to communicate what one wants and needs, and getting a fair price.   Also, my understanding was the folks that would benefit the most were those that weren't staying at the main IETF hotels with a high quality Internet connection.  We all know that there are a lot of crappy hotel networks out there and that a good network is imperative for all of us in getting our work done. So, making it a little easier for folks to get these SIM cards would seem to be a good thing to me and not an unreasonable service to ask the IAOC to work with the secretariat in obtaining.   The other option of course would be for the "experts on this topic" to be willing to go with the folks that are not experts and that don't speak the local language to assist them in their purchase.    [/MB]
> Bob
> _______________________________________________
> 87attendees mailing list