Re: [Anima] Adam Roach's Discuss on draft-ietf-anima-bootstrapping-keyinfra-22: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)

Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> Thu, 11 July 2019 21:49 UTC

Return-Path: <lear@cisco.com>
X-Original-To: anima@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: anima@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A064A120123; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 14:49:22 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -14.501
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.501 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZRBNHK1ZUXtW; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 14:49:21 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from rcdn-iport-7.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-7.cisco.com [173.37.86.78]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B3200120112; Thu, 11 Jul 2019 14:49:20 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=1520; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1562881761; x=1564091361; h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc: to:references; bh=M/imyc8oFuksmO65Ui0R43yZAPwzpwTwmdLHdwWd2xQ=; b=Eu8oYCkTymaCKHsGr8MyOZDpGVPS7oabsI1z4WJG/RLoPWAsTMx6+qlx r7w6BWYdNTWuHw902F31DZRNOC32b92CsK2OX6LT4Bz9IS4sXEEADdKT/ T8Boh0mYUXrbXCiScqZVZDMbIXWUcA7zYofjNRqpgNibIl8T7oGyjk8qZ M=;
X-Files: signature.asc : 195
X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true
X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0ADAAASridd/5ldJa1lGQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQcBAQEBAQGBUwQBAQEBAQsBghaBOwEyKIQciByKRYIPmHiBewIHAQEBCQMBAS8BAYRAAoJTIzQJDgEDAQEEAQECAQVthUiFSgEBAQECASNWBQsLGCMHAgJXBgoJgyIBgXsPrCSBMoVHhGYQgTQBgVCKDheBf4E4H4JMPodOMoImBIw1iDeVbwmCG4IfgQyQXRQHmAOhcoMLAgQGBQIVgVA4gVgzGggbFWUBgkE+gjqODz0DMJAGAQE
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.63,480,1557187200"; d="asc'?scan'208";a="589378043"
Received: from rcdn-core-2.cisco.com ([173.37.93.153]) by rcdn-iport-7.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA; 11 Jul 2019 21:49:19 +0000
Received: from rtp-vpn3-403.cisco.com (rtp-vpn3-403.cisco.com [10.82.217.149]) by rcdn-core-2.cisco.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPS id x6BLnFrL018796 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 11 Jul 2019 21:49:17 GMT
From: Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com>
Message-Id: <E2DA8D30-805E-478D-925D-534C04A0727F@cisco.com>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_A0B51367-4C1E-4F5C-AAC7-38EACACE60DD"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg="pgp-sha1"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\))
Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2019 23:49:13 +0200
In-Reply-To: <ACEB4033-707F-47AF-B58A-5227B444BEAB@cisco.com>
Cc: draft-ietf-anima-bootstrapping-keyinfra@ietf.org, Adam Roach <adam@nostrum.com>, anima-chairs@ietf.org, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, Toerless Eckert <tte+ietf@cs.fau.de>, anima@ietf.org
To: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
References: <156282703648.15280.17739830959261983790.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <17580.1562874933@localhost> <ACEB4033-707F-47AF-B58A-5227B444BEAB@cisco.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11)
X-Outbound-SMTP-Client: 10.82.217.149, rtp-vpn3-403.cisco.com
X-Outbound-Node: rcdn-core-2.cisco.com
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/anima/2gIXP-bZuFrwfabD-XVChYKAmyE>
Subject: Re: [Anima] Adam Roach's Discuss on draft-ietf-anima-bootstrapping-keyinfra-22: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
X-BeenThere: anima@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Autonomic Networking Integrated Model and Approach <anima.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/anima>, <mailto:anima-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/anima/>
List-Post: <mailto:anima@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:anima-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/anima>, <mailto:anima-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Jul 2019 21:49:23 -0000

Just to complete the thought:

Whether such a voucher would be pinned is something we do not have to specify, with the risks of it not being pinned being born by the owner.

Eliot

> On 11 Jul 2019, at 23:44, Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> wrote:
> 
> Signed PGP part
> One thought:
> 
> I think the simplest way to address the bulk of both Adam’s and Warren’s concern is to require the device to emit via whatever management interface exists, upon request, a voucher that it has signed with its own iDevID.  It would have to be nonceless with perhaps a long expiry, and that would cover a number of other use cases as well.  That way if the manufacturer goes out of business, or if the owner wants to transfer the device without manufacturer consent, there is a way forward.
> 
> Eliot
> 
>