Re: [Apn] Further revised draft Charter

Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com> Mon, 13 February 2023 04:58 UTC

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From: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 12 Feb 2023 23:58:05 -0500
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To: Mirja Kuehlewind <ietf@kuehlewind.net>
Cc: Feng Yang <yangfeng@chinamobile.com>, apn@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [Apn] Further revised draft Charter
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Hi Mirja,

On Wed, Jan 18, 2023 at 11:37 AM Mirja Kuehlewind <ietf@kuehlewind.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Feng,
>
> Why are you not just using the DSCP field or, if you need to provide more information to the network nodes, Network Service Header (NSH) encapsulation?

Things are always simpler in a small homogeneous network but you might
need something that works in a reasonably large domain which, while
under common management, uses heterogeneous protocols. In any case,
why are we twisting and turning about specific limited solutions at
this point?

In any case, if you are using DSCP for hop-by-hop behavior, you might
need different values for it in different parts of the domain. So, it
seems to me you really want some other quantity from which, when
appropriate, the DSCP and/or the L2 PCP etc are derived. You might
also need to invoke services at various points along the path of a
flow and I know of no standard way to do that based on DSCP. And it
doesn't have enough values.

As for SCF/NSH, it is strongly oriented to routing packets to a
sequence of services (such as NAT, Firewall, etc). As far as I know
there is no standard way to have an outer DSCP value derived from NSH
fields. It also imposes this encapsulation burden.

As I say, it might not be too hard in most cases to find some existing
solution to a small homogeneous network. But how to get an attribute,
possibly a logical attribute, that can invoke different treatments of
the packet in different parts of a large heterogeneous network is not
at all clear.

But should we be doing solution design on this mailing list? How about
a working group to look into use cases and gaps and a framework for a
solution?

Thanks,
Donald
===============================
 Donald E. Eastlake 3rd   +1-508-333-2270 (cell)
 2386 Panoramic Circle, Apopka, FL 32703 USA
 d3e3e3@gmail.com
> Mirja
>
>
> On 18. Jan 2023, at 12:53, Feng Yang <yangfeng@chinamobile.com> wrote:
>
> Dear WG,
>
>
> In the operator's network, we provide corresponding services for Internet services and bussiness services to meet the needs of a group of users with the same service requirements for the network, such as acceleration, and security for Internet services (e.g. SAVNet), and leased line for bussiness services,(e.g. slicing and service chaining).
>
>
>
> Currently, we are distinguishing services by source IP address at our network edge devices. But the source addresses are discrete, we hope there is a way to transform the address from discrete space into a linear space , which will make it be easier for classification, so that the services and policies can be combined in a simple way. Eventually that can improve our efficiency and reduce costs.
>
>
> This actually solves the fundamental problem that ACLs are difficult to apply at scale, and facilitates us to aggregate services in a linear space and statically configure a number of matching conditions by means of planning.
>
>
> I think this Charter clearly presents the work we would like to see, so I suggest it is best not to postpone APN Charter any longer, we should setup the WG first and discuss the actual work as soon as possible.
>
>
> The Spring festival is coming on this weekend. Best wishes for everyone. J
>
>
> BR,
>
>
> 杨锋
>
> Feng Yang