Re: [arch-d] FYI: closure of the IAB Stack Evolution program

[Joe Touch <[e-mail]>]

The only thing QUIC doesn’t do is demux via a single field of the IP header called “protocol”.

So?

Maybe this is a good thing - maybe it just goes to show middleboxes how incapable they are at actually knowing what’s going on.

Joe

> On Aug 25, 2019, at 10:19 PM, Fernando Gont <[e-mail]> wrote:
> 
> On 26/8/19 07:45, Joe Touch wrote:
>> 
>> 
>>> If IP is Internet, and QUIC is transport, what do you call the UDP that
>>> stis in between?
>> 
>> Therein lies the error.
>> 
>> QUIC alone is not a transport.
>> 
>> It’s not complete enough to be transport by itself. It doesn’t provide
>> the socket (as in RFC793’s idea of a socket) demuxing.
>> 
>> IMO, QUIC + UDP is a transport layer. A layer that provides a more
>> complex service than UDP alone.>
>> So yes, UDP is a transport layer - when operating by itself. But when
>> paired with QUIC, it is the pair that are the transport.
> 
> Maybe one of the underlying issues here is that one would normally
> expect one transport service as a single layer (i.e. protocol layer).
> But since this is not feasible in the current Internet, you get two
> protocol layers to offer a transport service you'd normally implement in
> a single one.
> 
> i.e., for QUIC you need two protocols to implement a specific transport
> service. You use one transport protocol (UDP) that doesn't provide the
> service you want (but get the packets through), and then stack abother
> protocol on top of it, that does all that is missing.
> 
> So I'd argue that it is correct that you can implement new transport
> *services*. However, the statement that you can deploy new transport
> *protocols* seems to be misleading (you're actually relying on a very
> simple transport protocol, and use its services as a building block for
> implementing a different transport service). This is what my original
> message tried to point out.
> 
> -- 
> Fernando Gont
> SI6 Networks
> e-mail: [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
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