Re: [arch-d] FYI: closure of the IAB Stack Evolution program

[Fernando Gont <[e-mail]>]

On 26/8/19 07:50, Joe Touch wrote:
> 
> 
>> On Aug 25, 2019, at 12:16 PM, Henning Schulzrinne <[e-mail]
>> <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
>>
>> Some of us who worked on the Open Internet (aka network neutrality)
>> saw "protocol neutrality" as very much part of the same spirit and
>> possibly a legal entitlement of customers. And the issue of naming
>> "Internet access" implying some obligations was also part of the
>> discussion. Experience seems to indicate that only legal or regulatory
>> requirements are likely to lead there,
> 
> That hasn’t been the case for SONET, ATM, or Ethernet services.
> 
> If we had a clear definition of “ISOC-certified Internet service”, then:
> a) customers might be willing to seek that
> b) customers who pay for that have a clear legal path if that’s what was
> offered and it isn’t true

If one means to get on that path, I'd start with certified
implementations -- at times, the service is a consequence of this.

One of the most obvious cases is e.g. IPv6 implementations that are
"IPv6 Ready", but then do an extremely lousy job (see "IPv6 Security
Assessment and Benchmarking" at
http://www.ipv6hackers.org/meetings/ipv6-hackers-1).



>> given that many carriers have no economic interest to do this - and
>> carrier-grade NATs make it painful or impossible to move beyond TCP
>> and UDP.
>>
>> Henning
> 
> We could have two versions of service - ISOC-certified true Internet and
> ISOC-certified translated Internet (the latter so we don’t freeze out
> carriers to start). People might pay more for the former.

Without giving this a lot of thought, the problem with "certified
Internet" is that one would expect that to apply to all destinations and
paths.

When should my ISP start billing me for the "true Internet" service?
When it works with Google, or with everyone? If the former: Does it
matter? If the latter: would it ever happen?

(I bet many of us, nevertheless, when prompted with the question of
which one we want to buy, would ask the question: what can I do with the
expensive one that I can't with the other? (as opposed to "what one
could *potentially* do).

-- 
Fernando Gont
SI6 Networks
e-mail: [e-mail]
PGP Fingerprint: 6666 31C6 D484 63B2 8FB1 E3C4 AE25 0D55 1D4E 7492