IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [art] On BCP 190

Mark Nottingham <mnot@mnot.net> Wed, 24 July 2019 13:35 UTC

Return-Path: <mnot@mnot.net>
X-Original-To: art@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: art@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B4651200E3 for <art@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 06:35:42 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.7
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=mnot.net header.b=tvqo5x1x; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=IOhVsEq6
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KllixyKU858u for <art@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 06:35:40 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from wout1-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout1-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.24]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A84A4120193 for <art@ietf.org>; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 06:35:38 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06C66412; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 09:35:37 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 24 Jul 2019 09:35:38 -0400
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mnot.net; h= content-type:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; s=fm3; bh=y 3EiI2XtMJt/6cV7zXLO29okiQh7fHMKXMJW50NjL3E=; b=tvqo5x1xgICU6zs8C P+HcmWQ3YZ5zkMnfOjX2zEkf3OoTpxxcI+uGvC4DRiJ2CJijMN3FZV8DUOqCLcSV 3FywodA9yzHjbOQLOI0qGiZj7Vgp/uaFqd0MHSjJ4sOfHz3shl/DS1+k2MNkXRKA I08qqUjM6YpmnW3gelfNm072mUWDIe+3EPLowIpTO2RPEWxSqt1Fc5kFjfVLQD2C 2VBfgyX2AZxYDXXk+q7okqy/n6OBoATdbkyRkRB7JJnjN6oFNanqN33pQZGKR2bS bZ/N0lx91pw2W8xDzUwygBmpQ7JEhxqwj9haTRW8jcoMn8pH+xnIESWIaYfRMWip Py3Rg==
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :subject:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender :x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=y3EiI2XtMJt/6cV7zXLO29okiQh7fHMKXMJW50NjL 3E=; b=IOhVsEq6d5vyqJjBzF8yjM4gEdscLZzBIpKDu7sLswuX1tvMwwuWJANuQ D665Cf+R+9bpwxVdTgAg/+YLybw22zh7GBtRZqOXWJwcoPl312J+UnjGz1MolpMu bPZ754e2u/VwADC0iwwWNpvn9ltozyjyuVwuK4cisCijgDgpnFeofrlW3K+LqpjT OFyG+7nLq0gBM0GD6dtJH251AgPJi2ybJ3E7Vj/8hCeZiNTfLjh2XHCZs4g10rVF tkxZaOhSSZLdVIzl6M5kFhmLdh51lIUdgVXiWI+0m+Oye3f2poYWR4lR7V7af9Aj +IydP/jVkfrnmsHiAHr21kOofBVoA==
X-ME-Sender: <xms:qF44XWeck6hRIBTs7Y3rutxmB7EFThBNEn3AYdmRypFGR8hVUgjdgg>
X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeduvddrkedtgdeivdcutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenuc fjughrpegtggfuhfgjfffgkfhfvffosehtqhhmtdhhtddvnecuhfhrohhmpeforghrkhcu pfhothhtihhnghhhrghmuceomhhnohhtsehmnhhothdrnhgvtheqnecuffhomhgrihhnpe hmnhhothdrnhgvthenucfkphepfedurddufeefrddufeejrddvfeegnecurfgrrhgrmhep mhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehmnhhothesmhhnohhtrdhnvghtnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivg eptd
X-ME-Proxy: <xmx:qF44XSi4tJIVS1g_Ob-KKFdl0xtZEv3xYTgNPssqVV4GhU8RhqThbQ> <xmx:qF44XWSA8XWiYWbtuwXsX8MwAOa4IggcGWgg0LspyMB7FYVtjEGIQg> <xmx:qF44XeLu7E6Nq3PqAPAMkXilFN07RNDMPuRgUPK2w9tvQmOAQ6Q-Kg> <xmx:qV44Xe2f4PqsUz9KLHsKZclEi2GjZNXx3iYMRHr1RT9ZGLv3cSWbRw>
Received: from dhcp-89ea.meeting.ietf.org (dhcp-89ea.meeting.ietf.org [31.133.137.234]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 0773E8005C; Wed, 24 Jul 2019 09:35:36 -0400 (EDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.11\))
From: Mark Nottingham <mnot@mnot.net>
In-Reply-To: <c2cb630c-1230-57c4-8688-27371eadabac@nomountain.net>
Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2019 09:35:32 -0400
Cc: art@ietf.org
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <4B9A518C-6E90-444F-924E-4153AA0E27C7@mnot.net>
References: <58BF6171-03BB-4F83-940F-3A101EFDD67F@mnot.net> <2ba63f8c-0f61-bd59-fbca-9d782a0d9818@mnt.se> <F81E44F7-7B51-4C68-9470-E94EFD2D4102@mnot.net> <e9780f61-681f-a5d9-7b06-549a2e652f5f@mnt.se> <42C8475A-6DFE-4DC6-B608-8159B90F9CDB@mnot.net> <55E6A246-4D77-44DA-AF2B-AA9C42FACC2F@mnt.se> <750cb62e-1256-4e3f-a072-438f6d468f2d@nostrum.com> <9847EF63-6BDE-4746-81C7-EA446FC5938E@mnt.se> <14ed2e66-938e-9ffd-7ff4-ef632c95db14@nostrum.com> <78D647A0-9DDF-444E-8FC0-38395892F054@mnot.net> <99D64809-8010-4E4D-B60E-DC7DD12C0F3B@mnt.se> <649DC0E7-513E-4004-BB9D-C94D9DD29AE7@mnot.net> <c2cb630c-1230-57c4-8688-27371eadabac@nomountain.net>
To: Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@nomountain.net>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.11)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/art/BEoTUl1Xa96H5iSBr7zAXECHIek>
Subject: Re: [art] On BCP 190
X-BeenThere: art@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Applications and Real-Time Area Discussion <art.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/art>, <mailto:art-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/art/>
List-Post: <mailto:art@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:art-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/art>, <mailto:art-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Jul 2019 13:35:42 -0000

If any impediment to shipping a protocol is considered "harm", we've got a problem. 


> On 24 Jul 2019, at 9:19 am, Melinda Shore <melinda.shore@nomountain.net> wrote:
> 
> Signed PGP part
> On 7/24/19 9:15 AM, Mark Nottingham wrote:
>> Do we usually set success criteria for BCPs?
> 
> I've never seen any, but it seems that it might be helpful,
> given that the trans wg is saying that being required to
> make changes to conform to BCP 190 causes harm to the CT
> protocol, to have that requirement based on actual harm done
> by not conforming.
> 
> Melinda
> 
> 
> -- 
> Software longa, hardware brevis
> 
> PGP key fingerprint  4F68 2D93 2A17 96F8 20F2
>                     34C0 DFB8 9172 9A76 DB8F
> 
> 
> 

--
Mark Nottingham   https://www.mnot.net/

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email