[Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanism?
"Bob Wyman" <bob@wyman.us> Mon, 19 May 2003 15:37 UTC
Received: from www1.ietf.org (ietf.org [132.151.1.19] (may be forged)) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA24681 for <asrg-archive@odin.ietf.org>; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:37:36 -0400 (EDT)
Received: (from mailnull@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) id h4JF6ZK25625 for asrg-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:06:35 -0400
Received: from ietf.org (odin.ietf.org [132.151.1.176]) by www1.ietf.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4JF6ZB25622 for <asrg-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org>; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:06:35 -0400
Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA24669; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:37:05 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 19Hmj0-0004B1-00; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:38:54 -0400
Received: from ietf.org ([132.151.1.19] helo=www1.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 19Hmiz-0004Ay-00; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:38:53 -0400
Received: from www1.ietf.org (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by www1.ietf.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4JF1KB25460; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:01:20 -0400
Received: from ietf.org (odin.ietf.org [132.151.1.176]) by www1.ietf.org (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h4JF0sB25402 for <asrg@optimus.ietf.org>; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:00:54 -0400
Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA24546 for <asrg@ietf.org>; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:31:09 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 19HmdG-00049W-00 for asrg@ietf.org; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:32:58 -0400
Received: from vmmrnat.verisignmail.com ([216.168.230.187] helo=vmmr9.verisignmail.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 19HmdA-00049H-00 for asrg@ietf.org; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:32:52 -0400
Received: from ms3.verisignmail.com (ms3.verisignmail.com [216.168.230.176] (may be forged)) by vmmr9.verisignmail.com (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.2-GA) with ESMTP id PFK52673; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:33:04 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from BOBDEV (pool-162-84-212-153.ny5030.east.verizon.net [162.84.212.153]) by ms3.verisignmail.com (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.2.2-GA) with ESMTP id AGO63743; Mon, 19 May 2003 11:33:03 -0400 (EDT)
Reply-To: bob@wyman.us
From: Bob Wyman <bob@wyman.us>
To: asrg@ietf.org
Message-ID: <001401c31e1b$f5d5b6c0$7101a8c0@BOBDEV>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.4024
X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165
Importance: Normal
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by www1.ietf.org id h4JF0sB25403
Subject: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanism?
Sender: asrg-admin@ietf.org
Errors-To: asrg-admin@ietf.org
X-BeenThere: asrg@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12
Precedence: bulk
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/asrg>, <mailto:asrg-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Id: Anti-Spam Research Group - IRTF <asrg.ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:asrg@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:asrg-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/asrg>, <mailto:asrg-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
List-Archive: <https://www1.ietf.org/pipermail/asrg/>
Date: Mon, 19 May 2003 11:33:12 -0400
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
One of the problems we have in solving the spam problem is that adoption of the required mechanisms, once defined, will be voluntary. This is the way of the Internet and has served us well all these years. But, will it stay that way? Can it stay that way? Many of the proposals for stopping spam require that originators, destinations and sometimes even intermediaries cooperate in some specific way. Given the vast number of mail servers, DNS servers, etc. it is likely that any mechanism that requires such agreement will take a very long time to put in place. Also, the benefits of the mechanism will be slow in being realized since systems will have to be tolerant of slow adopters for a very long time. You could have a "solution" to the spam problem today, but if it relies on cooperation from multiple components in the network, the slow adoption curve could make your method worthless. On the other hand, if the adoption curve could be accelerated, your method might have value. While we see all sorts of attempts to pass legislation making spam illegal, I haven't yet seen anyone discussing legislation requiring that specific anti-spam mechanisms or protocols be deployed. The rules of the Internet, unlike those of the telephony system, the airwaves, or our highways, have been largely voluntary. However, the Internet has become just as much a "common" good as are these other communications channels. Given the tremendous backlash against spam that we've seen lately, I wouldn't be surprised if we began to see proposals requiring that specific mechanisms be used to combat it. Just as new laws restricting civil liberties have been "collateral damage" of the anti-terrorism effort, new laws reducing the voluntary nature of Internet standards may be "collateral damage" of the anti-spam effort. We have already seen people write legislation that would make illegal the forging of FROM: addresses, requiring "ADV" in bulk mail subjects, etc. These proposals, which seek to constrain the way in which existing voluntary standards are used, are getting very, very close to mandating that a specific standard be used. What if they go just a little step farther? Hadmut thinks that RMX will save the day, at least in part, if only people used it. How should we react to a proposal that it be *required* in one country or another? Some folk have been arguing for S/MIME for years... Could its use be required by law? Should it? The adoption of PKI for signatures has been terribly slow but if accelerated, it might help us solve the spam problem. Could legislation speed it up? Note: I am not suggesting that network protocol design be made the subject of legislation. It is hard enough to do in the IETF... Doing network design in Congress, parliament, etc. is going to be a "challenge..." I'm just pointing out that current trends could be leading us in this direction. The result might be a reduction in spam, but also a fundamental change in the way that the Internet evolves and is governed. The spammers may take more from us then bandwidth, time, and disk space... bob wyman _______________________________________________ Asrg mailing list Asrg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/asrg
- [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanism? Bob Wyman
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Barry Shein
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Jeffrey Race
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… waltdnes
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Eric Brunner-Williams in Portland Maine
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Jeffrey Race
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Eric Brunner-Williams in Portland Maine
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Daniel Feenberg
- RE: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Eric D. Williams
- RE: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Tom Thomson
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Eric Brunner-Williams in Portland Maine
- RE: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Tom Thomson
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Eric Brunner-Williams in Portland Maine
- Re: [Asrg] Could/Should/Must law require mechanis… Eric Brunner-Williams in Portland Maine