Re: [Asrg] IPR Document Update

Yakov Shafranovich <> Mon, 09 June 2003 01:32 UTC

Received: from ( [] (may be forged)) by (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA05943 for <>; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 21:32:15 -0400 (EDT)
Received: (from mailnull@localhost) by (8.11.6/8.11.6) id h591Vnt07212 for; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 21:31:49 -0400
Received: from ( []) by (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h591VnB07209 for <>; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 21:31:49 -0400
Received: from ietf-mx ( []) by (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA05936; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 21:31:45 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from ietf-mx ([]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 19PBTm-0006d0-00; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 21:29:46 -0400
Received: from ([] by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 19PBTl-0006cx-00; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 21:29:45 -0400
Received: from (localhost.localdomain []) by (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h591USB07119; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 21:30:28 -0400
Received: from ( []) by (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h591TKB07072 for <>; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 21:29:20 -0400
Received: from ietf-mx ( []) by (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA05875 for <>; Sun, 8 Jun 2003 21:29:15 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from ietf-mx ([]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 19PBRM-0006c9-00 for; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 21:27:16 -0400
Received: from ([] helo= ident=trilluser) by ietf-mx with smtp (Exim 4.12) id 19PBRL-0006c3-00 for; Sun, 08 Jun 2003 21:27:16 -0400
Message-Id: <>
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version
To: Vernon Schryver <>,, Paul Judge <>
From: Yakov Shafranovich <>
Subject: Re: [Asrg] IPR Document Update
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format="flowed"
X-MimeHeaders-Plugin-Info: v2.03.00
X-GCMulti: 1
X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12
Precedence: bulk
List-Unsubscribe: <>, <>
List-Id: Anti-Spam Research Group - IRTF <>
List-Post: <>
List-Help: <>
List-Subscribe: <>, <>
List-Archive: <>
Date: Sun, 08 Jun 2003 21:28:48 -0400

Dear Vernon,

1. For the record of all the ASRG members - I am not a lawyer and do not 
claim to be one. The entire purpose of this document that I am keeping on 
my own free time, it to record any IPR issues as they come up on the list. 
I am not searching the USPTO database, not Googling the entire Internet 
looking for patents. Neither am I analyzing them. If you would have taken 
care to go through the list, then you would have seen that no where do I 
offer my own analysis. All statements have been take from either public 
sources or from ASRG list postings.
2. The analysis statement in question was made by Bob Wyman not by me (see
I simply paraphrased it.
3. I moved the statement from the notes section to be directly under the 
list posting reference to make it more clear. I also removed the reference 
to DCC which seems to have irked you. I re-quoted the original statement as 
it was written by Bob instead of paraphrasing it.
4. Once again, my list is not intended to keep track of all IPR issues in 
the world, only of the ones that come up on the list. Are you implying that 
I should remove all references to all list postings simply because no one 
on the list except for you is qualified to express any opinions on IPR matters?


At 06:24 PM 6/8/2003 -0600, Vernon Schryver wrote:

> > From: Yakov Shafranovich <>
> > The IPR document for the ASRG has been updated. The following was changed:
> >
> > ADDED: Section 4.2.1. Jakob Nielsen's patent on coordinated filtering. 
> This
> > affects systems such as SpamNet, Matador and DCC.
>Such obviously false analyses are not helpful.  That I trust you
>didn't intend to make a mistake and don't know why your analysis
>is false for at least one, probably two, and quite possibly all
>three of those mechanisms is all the more reason to not offer such
>analyses in the future.
>Statements about which patents affect which tactics based on ignorance
>of those tactics and superficial reading of patent claims asside, your
>list of patents could be interesting to people trying to avoid a few
>arbitrarily chosen patents, but it would be utterly foolish to rely
>on your list instead of a patent search.  Your list can never be
>comprehensive without doing a real patent search, and even then one
>cannot know about impending patents.
>I apologize for this less than friendly note, but potentially damaging
>bogus analyses of intellectual property need to be challenged and
>squelched.  In the future, please just collect the patents and leave
>the analyzing to patent lawyers, or at least people who are familiar
>with the various anti-spam mechanisms.

Asrg mailing list