Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? Support only EUI-64interfaces?
"Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> Mon, 02 August 2010 17:30 UTC
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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: Ulrich Herberg <ulrich@herberg.name>, Teco Boot <teco@inf-net.nl>
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2010 10:31:05 -0700
Thread-Topic: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? Support only EUI-64interfaces?
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Cc: "autoconf@ietf.org autoconf@ietf.org" <autoconf@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? Support only EUI-64interfaces?
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Ulrich, > -----Original Message----- > From: Ulrich Herberg [mailto:ulrich@herberg.name] > Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 9:55 AM > To: Teco Boot > Cc: Templin, Fred L; autoconf@ietf.org autoconf@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? Support only EUI-64interfaces? > > Teco, > > On Sat, Jul 31, 2010 at 3:56 PM, Teco Boot <teco@inf-net.nl> wrote: > > Fred, > > > > Do you mean DHCP relay can be used on a node, that request an address > > for itself? > > I have tried that a while ago. It works with some limitations (see below). > > > > > I think it could work this way: > > 1) Node queries with link-local to All_DHCP_Relay_Agents_and_Servers. > > 2a) Node acts as also relay and queries with ULA (site-local) to All_DHCP_Servers. > > Do you mean that a node is DHCP client and relay in the same time? > That is not possible according to RFC3315, which says (i) in section > 15.13 "clients MUST discard any received Relay-forward messages" The client function would never see a Relay-forward, because that is generated by the relay function and sent to either the unicast address of a server or All-DHCP-Servers multicast. Maybe you meant section 15.14 "Clients and servers MUST discard any received Relay-reply messages"? But, it is the node's relay function (and not the client function) that gets the Relay-reply so this is not in violation of the spec. > and > (ii) section 15.3 "servers and relay agents MUST discard any received > Advertise messages". The node's client function (and not the relay function) is the one that gets the Advertise message when 4-message exchange is used; the relay function sees only the Relay-reply and then forwards the Advertise on to the client function. Also, in 2-message exchange there is no Advertise message. Fred fred.l.templin@boeing.com > Also, the relay would need to have a direct unicast connection to the > central node or use other relaying mechanisms such as SMF (as you > mentioned below), because multiple relaying is not really feasible in > DHCPv6 itself: Relaying uses encapsulation, so packets would be > encapsulated at every hop, quickly increasing overhead. And I also > don't think that DHCP relaying allows duplicate packet detection. > > > 2b) If node is provisioned with DHCP server unicast address, it could use that > > instead of All_DHCP_Servers. > > Sure, that is possible if a unicast routing protocol is used. > > > I think this is in line with your RFC 5558. > > > > Drawback of 1: it can result in high number of relayed DHCP packets, in case > > of many neighbors. > > True. > > > Another drawback of 1: there is a timeout delay when there is no relay or server > > at one hop. > > But I guess this timeout can be set dynamically? > > > > > For 2a: the network needs multicast support. Could be SMF. > > Yes, that could be a possibility. > > > > > > For both 2a and 2b: a temporally used unicast address must be routable. So this > > DHCP mechanism can only be used as a second step, moving from the self-generated > > address to a centrally managed address. > > Yes, that seems possible (but I have to re-read the DHCPv6 RFC after > my vacations ;-) > > Ulrich > > > > > Teco > > > > > > > > > > Op 30 jul 2010, om 17:40 heeft Templin, Fred L het volgende geschreven: > > > >> Teco, > >> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: autoconf-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:autoconf-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Teco Boot > >>> Sent: Friday, July 30, 2010 4:58 AM > >>> To: autoconf@ietf.org autoconf@ietf.org > >>> Subject: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? Support only EUI-64interfaces? > >>> > >>> RFC3315: > >>> ... The client > >>> MUST use a link-local address assigned to the interface for which it > >>> is requesting configuration information as the source address in the > >>> header of the IP datagram. > >>> > >>> Question: can we get around a MUST in a standards track RFC? > >>> I don't think so. > >> > >> If the MANET router only behaves as a client on an internal > >> link (e.g., a loopback) but behaves as a relay on its MANET > >> interfaces, then link-locals need not be exposed for DHCPv6 > >> purposes. There are other reasons why link-locals might need > >> to be considered for MANETs, but I'm not sure this is one > >> of them. > >> > >> Fred > >> fred.l.templin@boeing.com > >> > >>> The to be posted proposed text for to be RFC5889 would say that if link-locals are used, there > are > >>> potential problems when using other than modified EUI-64 IIDs, and therefore must be based on > >>> modified EUI-64 IIDs. > >>> > >>> Second question, on first item in charter: do we limit ourself to MANET routers that has modified > >>> EUI-64 link-locals? > >>> I think: better think twice. > >>> > >>> Opinions? > >>> > >>> Teco. > >>> > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Autoconf mailing list > >>> Autoconf@ietf.org > >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Autoconf mailing list > > Autoconf@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf > >
- [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? Suppo… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Dearlove, Christopher (UK)
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Templin, Fred L
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Dearlove, Christopher (UK)
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Alexandru Petrescu
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Alexandru Petrescu
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Alexandru Petrescu
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Dearlove, Christopher (UK)
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Dearlove, Christopher (UK)
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Templin, Fred L
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Ulrich Herberg
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Templin, Fred L
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Ulrich Herberg
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Alexandru Petrescu
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Ulrich Herberg
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Henning Rogge
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Ulrich Herberg
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Rogge Henning
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Henning Rogge
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Teco Boot
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Carlos Jesús Bernardos Cano
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Alexandru Petrescu
- Re: [Autoconf] Using DHCPv6 without link-local? S… Joe Macker