Re: [Ietf-carddav] Comments on draft-daboo-carddav-02

Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de> Mon, 16 July 2007 16:31 UTC

Return-Path: <julian.reschke@gmx.de>
X-Original-To: ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org
Delivered-To: ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org
Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE66C8053B for <ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org>; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 09:31:21 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D34D814220D for <ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org>; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 09:30:26 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org
X-Spam-Score: -1.457
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.457 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.944, BAYES_00=-2.599, DNS_FROM_RFC_ABUSE=0.2, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001]
Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZVoVcXfz4n06 for <ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org>; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 09:30:26 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail203c25.carrierzone.com (mail203c25.carrierzone.com [64.29.147.79]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20143142201 for <ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org>; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 09:30:26 -0700 (PDT)
X-Authenticated-User: master.tencoassemblies.com
Received: from TENCOSERVER.TencoAssembliesInc.local (static-68-162-87-75.phil.east.verizon.net [68.162.87.75]) (authenticated bits=0) by mail203c25.carrierzone.com (8.13.6.20060614/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l6GGUCxf010700; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:30:21 GMT
Received: from TENCOSERVER.TencoAssembliesInc.local ([10.0.0.2]) by TENCOSERVER.TencoAssembliesInc.local with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Mon, 16 Jul 2007 12:30:12 -0400
Received: by TENCOSERVER.TencoAssembliesInc.local (Microsoft Connector for POP3 Mailboxes 5.00.2195) with SMTP (Global POP3 Download) id MSG07162007-123011-11791.MMD@TencoAssembliesInc.local; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 12:30:11 -0400
X-From_: w3c-dist-auth-request@frink.w3.org Mon Jul 16 16:29:07 2007
X-Envelope-From: w3c-dist-auth-request@frink.w3.org
Received: from frink.w3.org (frink.w3.org [128.30.52.16]) by mail2570.carrierzone.com (8.13.6.20060614/8.13.1) with ESMTP id l6GGT6SG009430 for <JTentilucci@tencoassemblies.com>; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:29:07 GMT
Received: from lists by frink.w3.org with local (Exim 4.50) id 1IATQi-0000Ml-Nd for w3c-dist-auth-dist@listhub.w3.org; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:28:12 +0000
Received: from lisa.w3.org ([128.30.52.41]) by frink.w3.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1IATQh-0000Lm-Pg for w3c-dist-auth@listhub.w3.org; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:28:11 +0000
Received: from mail.gmx.net ([213.165.64.20]) by lisa.w3.org with smtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from <julian.reschke@gmx.de>) id 1IATQb-00036J-JE for w3c-dist-auth@w3.org; Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:28:11 +0000
Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 16 Jul 2007 16:27:57 -0000
Received: from mail.greenbytes.de (EHLO [192.168.1.87]) [217.91.35.233] by mail.gmx.net (mp027) with SMTP; 16 Jul 2007 18:27:57 +0200
X-Authenticated: #1915285
X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX1/aWiRAkGPayplzRqBtgD4VKWZoXebGP037oRXnxq gPw1DkN5dEnyy6
Message-ID: <469B9C87.9070404@gmx.de>
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 18:27:51 +0200
From: Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; de; rv:1.8.0.4) Gecko/20060516 Thunderbird/1.5.0.4 Mnenhy/0.7.4.666
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: "Mr. Demeanour" <mrdemeanour@jackpot.uk.net>
References: <4699F52B.10101@gmx.de> <DA70918551A4706E579F3829@caldav.corp.apple.com> <469B8976.9040402@jackpot.uk.net> <C4E535EC204E5BF24F6076F0@caldav.corp.apple.com> <469B91A2.5000002@jackpot.uk.net> <469B9319.7090204@gmx.de> <469B9A9F.5050604@jackpot.uk.net>
In-Reply-To: <469B9A9F.5050604@jackpot.uk.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0
Received-SPF: pass
X-SPF-Guess: pass
X-W3C-Hub-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6
X-W3C-Scan-Sig: lisa.w3.org 1IATQb-00036J-JE 9b59b62e883f89e4f12f54c07c4d4937
X-Original-To: w3c-dist-auth@w3.org
Subject: Re: [Ietf-carddav] Comments on draft-daboo-carddav-02
X-Archived-At: http://www.w3.org/mid/469B9C87.9070404@gmx.de
Resent-From: w3c-dist-auth@w3.org
X-Mailing-List: <w3c-dist-auth@w3.org> archive/latest/12731
X-Loop: w3c-dist-auth@w3.org
Sender: w3c-dist-auth-request@w3.org
Resent-Sender: w3c-dist-auth-request@w3.org
Precedence: list
Resent-Message-Id: <E1IATQi-0000Ml-Nd@frink.w3.org>
Resent-Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:28:12 +0000
X-Antivirus: Scanned by F-Prot Antivirus (http://www.f-prot.com)
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jul 2007 16:30:12.0832 (UTC) FILETIME=[9575B600:01C7C7C6]
Cc: w3c-dist-auth@w3.org, ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org
X-BeenThere: ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5
List-Id: ietf-carddav.osafoundation.org
List-Unsubscribe: <http://lists.osafoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ietf-carddav>, <mailto:ietf-carddav-request@osafoundation.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://lists.osafoundation.org/pipermail/ietf-carddav>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf-carddav@osafoundation.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-carddav-request@osafoundation.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <http://lists.osafoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/ietf-carddav>, <mailto:ietf-carddav-request@osafoundation.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:31:31 -0000

Mr. Demeanour wrote:
> Yes, that's correct, as far as I can see.
> 
> If one did that, however, the consequence would be that the GET method
> would then become anomalous for CalDAV and CardDAV resources; the data
> that it returned would be properties masquerading as content. Similarly
> the PUT method would become obsolete, as any CalDAV or CardDAV content
> should then be set using PROPPATCH. Anyway, it seems most natural to map
> iCalendar/vCard properties to WebDAV properties, rather than to WebDAV
> content.

I think GET and PUT should just continue to do what they do today.

> I don't really see that as a terrible problem for CalDAV and CardDAV;
> GET and PUT on CalDAV/CardDAV resources could be left undefined, or
> those methods could be freed-up for other purposes. GET, in particular,
> might be used to present a rendition of the resource. The fact that GET
> is easy to cache, and PROPFIND and REPORT are not, would be quite
> consistent with that approach - returning a stale, cached version of a
> rendition would be a much less serious problem than returning stale
> (but live) property data.

You mean, like an HTML view? That can always be done using content 
negotiation, I'd say.

> This all feels a bit theoretical, though; to make all CalDAV/CardDAV
> content become instead grade-A properties would be a pretty fundamental
> change in approach, affecting five or six different RFCs, and I hesitate
> to suggest anything that radical (without working it through properly
> first!).

Sorry? It would only affect a single RFC (RFC4791), no?

Best regards, Julian