Re: [Cbor] [Anima] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR question)
Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> Tue, 23 August 2022 22:51 UTC
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Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2022 10:51:12 +1200
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To: Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de>, Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>
Cc: anima@ietf.org, cbor@ietf.org
References: <Yv+miC76QMc887cJ@faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <A303E7B3-A83F-4B04-9C6F-5143E4A0B54D@tzi.org> <5fa4a9c7-bc0a-cba0-04fb-4cf5e7777c9e@gmail.com> <4E167B3F-9C68-4333-BB76-36119B8F39DF@tzi.org> <fa2a8d32-929d-46ec-97b3-b67ad33c23b7@gmail.com> <YwNHvF1wzS0yaZGe@faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <899DC56C-C1B5-4DC2-99DA-694B3FEF7C56@tzi.org> <YwSthGEEUDGgqqqz@faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de>
From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/cbor/rsYHh2ifZGtWNNHO5tfr533AVYQ>
Subject: Re: [Cbor] [Anima] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR question)
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On 23-Aug-22 22:35, Toerless Eckert wrote: > On Mon, Aug 22, 2022 at 08:43:57PM +0200, Carsten Bormann wrote: > [... snip...] >>> 2) Still want to understand .within correctly i think it does not doe >>> not work as you hope above. >>> >>> Carsten claimed offlist, that in your above syntax, grasp-option would >>> match some option that is not yet defined, as long as it matches >>> option-structure. From reading rfc8610, i think this is wrong, because >>> numeric-option is an AND between option and option-structure, so only >>> any currently defined options will be matched. No extensibility to >>> include any future options, even if they match option-structure. >> >> I’m not sure I understand the context of this, but yes, .within is a .and. So you have to have both message-structure accept the message and the message choice as well. >> >> Obviously, we need a second layer of extensibility beyond adding new messages: adding new options to a message. > > I think we've got that covered in our understanding. Except that for me this will be a rare event since it requires updates to the core part of GRASP, and should be avoided unless essential. > >> So each message production should have a *grasp-really-option at the end, where that stands for an actual (registered) option. > > But that would not suffice to receive and ignore an option that > was not specified in the CDDL at the time of the implementation of the > receiver. No, because *in any case* that is done by the programmer who writes the decoder. The programmer needs text instructions; the CDDL cannot provide those instructions. > >>> Of course, i can be wrong, but then rfc8610 text is really misleading. >>> >>> 3) Here is what i propose: >>> >>> >>> grasp-option = valid-option / objective / any >>> valid-option = option .within option-structure >> >> (Valid-option is your grasp-really-option.) >> >>> option-structure = [*any] >> >> No, an option starts with an option-type, so this should be >> >> option-structure = [option-type, *any] > > Oops. typo. Thanks > >>> option-type = uint >> >> Yep. >> >> >>> >>> >>> flood-message = [M_FLOOD, session-id, initiator, ttl, >>> +[objective, (locator-option / [])], *grasp-option] >> >> Yes. >> >>> "All other"-message = [ ... existing definitions ..., *grasp-option] >> >> Yes, that would be the whole-sale introduction of the second layer. >> (Grasp-really-option, actually.) >> >> The [~message, *grasp-really-option] approach might be able to do this with fewer changes. > > Hah. "~" is the unravel i was asking for in my other mail. Can that be > used to do inline moficiation: > > flood-message = [ ~flood-message, *grasp-option ] > > Or does that have to be a new name on the left-hand side ? > >>> […] >> >>> We may also want to carve out ranges to indicate that an option received >>> with such a numbe,if not known to the receiver must not be ignored but >>> needs to result in an error condition. >> >> (Negative numbers would lend themselves to this…) > > Right... > >>> 5) M_FLOOD >>> >>> M_FLOOD still has the added issue, that it can have multiple objectives, >>> and we do not have a way to express per-objective options. Which bugs me. >> >> … a fourth layer of extensibility… > > Yeah. Still trying to find the killer use-case of two objectives requring different > options to make that point. My opinion today is that it was a mistake to allow multiple objectives in one flood message. We should have stuck to a KISS approach. Brian > > Thanks > Toerless > >> >> Grüße, Carsten >> >> >
- [Cbor] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR quest… Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Cbor] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR q… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Cbor] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR q… Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Cbor] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR q… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Cbor] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR q… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Cbor] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR q… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Cbor] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR q… Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Cbor] [Anima] GRASP packet header extensions… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Cbor] GRASP packet header extensions (CBOR q… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Cbor] [Anima] GRASP packet header extensions… Brian E Carpenter
- [Cbor] CDDL sockets (was: Re: [Anima] GRASP packe… Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Cbor] [Anima] GRASP packet header extensions… Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Cbor] CDDL sockets (was: Re: [Anima] GRASP p… Derek Atkins
- Re: [Cbor] [Anima] CDDL sockets (was: Re: GRASP p… Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Cbor] CDDL sockets (was: Re: [Anima] GRASP p… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Cbor] [Anima] CDDL sockets (was: Re: GRASP p… Toerless Eckert
- Re: [Cbor] [Anima] CDDL sockets (was: Re: GRASP p… Carsten Bormann
- Re: [Cbor] [Anima] GRASP packet header extensions… Brian E Carpenter