[CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: drafts received, and a two week comment period
Simon Josefsson <simon@josefsson.org> Sun, 12 July 2026 08:51 UTC
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From: Simon Josefsson <simon@josefsson.org>
To: Ilari Liusvaara <ilariliusvaara@welho.com>
In-Reply-To: <alKZw96NpqDCm9y5@LK-Perkele-VII2.locald> (Ilari Liusvaara's message of "Sat, 11 Jul 2026 22:30:11 +0300")
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Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2026 10:51:03 +0200
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Subject: [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: drafts received, and a two week comment period
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Ilari Liusvaara <ilariliusvaara@welho.com> writes: > On Fri, Jul 10, 2026 at 05:44:07PM -0700, Eric Rescorla wrote: >> >> Exactly. One could think of this as notionally providing an API with certain >> guarantees and one ought to be able to (1) analyze a protocol based solely >> on those guarantees without knowing the details of the KEM and (2) swap >> in any approved KEM as long as it provided those guarantees. > > The difficult part of that is what those guarantees should be. > > The requirements vary a lot from protocol to protocol. This ranges from > needing OW-CONF (met by any useful KEM), to needing very exotic > properties (that are very rarely met). Indeed. I think a requirement that "other KEMs should have the same shape as ML-KEM" is in practice just another way of saying that we should only have ML-KEM, since there is likely to be some way to identify a particular shape of some KEM to be different from ML-KEM. We don't really know an exhaustive list of all properties that future consumers of KEM may need. Nor can we reasonable know this today. Consumers of the KEMs will need to figure out their requirements. For any applications, this will rule out some set of KEMs, but allow others. For the majority of IETF applications, I think that almost any of the common KEMs suffice though, especially when used with a hybrid combiner like Chempat. /Simon
- [CFRG] Per-KEM security considerations: drafts re… Nick Sullivan
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… D. J. Bernstein
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Nick Sullivan
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Nick Sullivan
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Loganaden Velvindron
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Nick Sullivan
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Eric Rescorla
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… John Mattsson
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… John Mattsson
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Eric Rescorla
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Simon Josefsson
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Richard Barnes
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Eric Rescorla
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… D. J. Bernstein
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Ilari Liusvaara
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Simon Josefsson
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Ilari Liusvaara
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Ilari Liusvaara
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… D. J. Bernstein
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Songbo Bu
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Simon Josefsson
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… 박종환_교수_컴퓨터과학전공
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… D. J. Bernstein
- [CFRG] Re: Per-KEM security considerations: draft… Simon Josefsson