Re: [cicm] CICM BOF Summary
"Novikov, Lev" <lnovikov@mitre.org> Wed, 03 August 2011 13:58 UTC
Return-Path: <lnovikov@mitre.org>
X-Original-To: cicm@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: cicm@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9035721F8AF0 for <cicm@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 3 Aug 2011 06:58:09 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.599
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id osh-aGERPs-S for <cicm@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 3 Aug 2011 06:58:09 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from smtpksrv1.mitre.org (smtpksrv1.mitre.org [198.49.146.77]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFD6321F8AE9 for <cicm@ietf.org>; Wed, 3 Aug 2011 06:58:08 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from smtpksrv1.mitre.org (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 99F5221B1AD6; Wed, 3 Aug 2011 09:58:20 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from imchub2.MITRE.ORG (imchub2.mitre.org [129.83.29.74]) by smtpksrv1.mitre.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92F6621B1A39; Wed, 3 Aug 2011 09:58:20 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from IMCMBX3.MITRE.ORG ([129.83.29.206]) by imchub2.MITRE.ORG ([129.83.29.74]) with mapi; Wed, 3 Aug 2011 09:58:20 -0400
From: "Novikov, Lev" <lnovikov@mitre.org>
To: "CICM Discussion List (cicm@ietf.org)" <cicm@ietf.org>, "cryptography@randombit.net" <cryptography@randombit.net>
Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2011 09:56:44 -0400
Thread-Topic: [cicm] CICM BOF Summary
Thread-Index: AcxRi5TNyTXvPoKxTzSpXV1w6blPTgAWR1yw
Message-ID: <F9AB58FA72BAE7449E7723791F6993ED0630A84E0F@IMCMBX3.MITRE.ORG>
References: <F9AB58FA72BAE7449E7723791F6993ED0630A84D03@IMCMBX3.MITRE.ORG> <CAOPE6Ph4ui1ZLL8y91mX7mNbGzxKM5BFANdpSXVbbTxBQ2fhdw@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAOPE6Ph4ui1ZLL8y91mX7mNbGzxKM5BFANdpSXVbbTxBQ2fhdw@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [cicm] CICM BOF Summary
X-BeenThere: cicm@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
Reply-To: CICM Discussion List <cicm@ietf.org>
List-Id: CICM Discussion List <cicm.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/cicm>, <mailto:cicm-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cicm>
List-Post: <mailto:cicm@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:cicm-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cicm>, <mailto:cicm-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2011 13:58:09 -0000
NOTE: Cross-posting from cicm@ietf.org to cryptography@randombit.net (Hat-tip: Kevin Wall) Last week we had a BOF at IETF 81. Thanks to all who attended (in-person and via Jabber). For those who couldn't make it, a summary: --- Begin Summary --- Dan Harkins and Dan Lanz were the BOF Chairs. Sean Turner and Stephen Farrell are the Security ADs. Vincent Roca presented slides about using CICM in a High Assurance, High Performance Security Gateway. Slides: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/81/slides/cicm-1.pdf Lev Novikov presented slides about CICM's logical model and how security domain separation makes CICM different from other crypto APIs. Slides: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/81/slides/cicm-2.pdf There were several points of discussion: 1. What about existing approaches: * Why can't you extend PKCS#11 so that crypto operations like encrypt always return TRUE? A few reasons were given: (a) CICM needs richer semantics (more and different kinds of inputs) than what is available in PKCS#11. Previous attempts at extending PKCS#11 became a mess. (b) Return values can be more complex than just TRUE (e.g., list of things that went wrong). * What about using an existing protocol as an interface? CICM could sit under such a protocol; it is also intended manage the crypto (note the large number of management commands), and not just the pipe (channel). * Which approach, C-style or object-oriented, was intended? The .NET crypto classes might be suitable for an object-oriented approach. CICM is defined in IDL for which one can generate bindings in many different languages including C, C++, Java, etc. We will have to investigate the .NET approach further. ** There was a request that folks on the list discuss these issues for the benefit of the community. 2. The charter is insufficient for a Working Group: * It was noted that there could be two goals: (a) to produce multi-vendor support for a standard interface (b) to introduce these concepts into existing IETF protocols * The charter appears to be too detailed; it should focus more on outlining the problem scope well. * CICM appears to address requirements that are not well explained in published documents. * How would CICM work with Authenticated Encryption with Authenticated Data [RFC 5116], TLS, or IPSEC? What are the consequences on other protocols? The major consequence of these points is that we should re-write the charter and write documents to address the: * larger problem scope * logical model (in more generic terms) and requirements * impact of this logical model on 2-3 existing protocols * details for an corresponding API (e.g., CICM) --- End Summary --- More on this to follow. Lev
- [cicm] CICM BOF Summary Novikov, Lev
- Re: [cicm] CICM BOF Summary Kevin W. Wall
- Re: [cicm] CICM BOF Summary jmitola
- Re: [cicm] CICM BOF Summary Novikov, Lev