Re: [clouds] Thoughts on CloudOPS

<david.black@emc.com> Wed, 16 February 2011 20:08 UTC

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From: <david.black@emc.com>
To: <stpeter@stpeter.im>
Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2011 15:08:44 -0500
Thread-Topic: [clouds] Thoughts on CloudOPS
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Subject: Re: [clouds] Thoughts on CloudOPS
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+1, --David

> -----Original Message-----
> From: clouds-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:clouds-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Peter Saint-Andre
> Sent: Wednesday, February 16, 2011 2:52 PM
> To: Bhumip Khasnabish
> Cc: clouds@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [clouds] Thoughts on ClooudOPS
> 
> I see no reason to delay closing of this list.
> 
> In fact, I suggest that it might be more productive for folks who are interested in these topics to
> self-organize on lists hosted elsewhere, instead of continuing to consume IETF bandwidth (both
> electronic and mental).
> 
> On 2/16/11 10:29 AM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:
> > I am requesting Peter to keep this mailing list up and running until
> > cloudops@ietf.org <mailto:cloudops@ietf.org>or dcops@ietf.org
> > <mailto:dcops@ietf.org> and cloudApps@ietf.org
> > <mailto:cloudApps@ietf.org>or vdi@ietforg <mailto:vdi@ietforg>are
> > created.
> >
> > Ron, Pls let me know what we need to do to get cloudops@ietf.org
> > <mailto:cloudops@ietf.org>or dcops@ietf.org
> > <mailto:dcops@ietf.org>created.
> >
> > Peter, Is it possible to keep clouds@ietf.org <mailto:clouds@ietf.org>
> > for CloudApps (with focus on VDI) discussion. If not pls consider my
> > request to create vdi@ietf.org <mailto:vdi@ietf.org>, and may be we
> > can keep the same WiKi website to keep the contributions.. PLS let me
> > know what you think and how we should proceed. Thanks again. Best.
> > Bhumip
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Feb 16, 2011 at 12:17 PM, Spencer Dawkins
> > <spencer@wonderhamster.org <mailto:spencer@wonderhamster.org>>
> > wrote:
> >
> > Just to mention one more issue ...
> >
> > Peter Saint-Andre said he would request that the IETF Secretariat
> > close this mailing list two weeks ago.
> >
> > If you guys would like to have a place to discuss CloudOPS (or Data
> > Center Ops, or ...) it would probably be great if you requested a
> > mailing list for that. I'm thinking that Ron Bonica would be the right
> > contact for that.
> >
> > If you guys would like to have a place to discuss Virtual Desktop
> > stuff, Peter said he might be willing to create a mailing list for
> > that, so he would be an excellent choice as the contact for that.
> >
> > I'm kind of surprised that this mailing list is still working at all
> > :-)
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Spencer
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "marcelo bagnulo braun"
> > <marcelo@it.uc3m.es <mailto:marcelo@it.uc3m.es>> To: <clouds@ietf.org
> > <mailto:clouds@ietf.org>> Sent: Friday, February 11, 2011 2:00 PM
> >
> > Subject: Re: [clouds] Thoughts on ClooudOPS
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > just to point out some issues...
> >
> > below...
> >
> > El 11/02/11 20:48, So, Ning escribió:
> >
> >
> > Bhumip and all,
> >
> > As discussed in this morning’s call, here are my personal views on the
> > proposed CloudOPS WG and the related drafts.
> >
> > Frameworks, high-level requirements, and best practices descriptions
> > on cloud infrastructure that impact multiple IETF protocols under
> > different areas and WGs,
> >
> > If it is an OPS area WG what you are proposing, then the work you
> > propose should fall into OPS, don't you think? (as opposed to multiple
> > areas) If the work you propose fall into other WG, then it should go
> > to the other WGs, right?
> >
> >
> > and/or protocols outside of IETF, belong to the CloudOPS WG.
> >
> > If protocols are outside the IETF, then they shouldn't be defined in
> > the IETF, don't you agree?
> >
> > New protocols that impact multiple IETF protocols under different
> > areas and WGs,
> >
> > similar comment here, if this is an OPS WG, then it should work within
> > the OPS area scope again, if the protocol is being defined in another
> > WG, then the work should be done in that WG.
> >
> >
> > and/or protocols outside of IETF, also belong to the CloudOPS WG.
> >
> > work outside the IETF, should be done, well, outside the IETF
> >
> > ARMD WG’s work is very focused and much needed, and I voiced my
> > support for its establishment. However, I see difficulties in
> > broadening its charter to make it a single and only default CloudOPS
> > WG. All the non-ARMD related drafts will become distraction and cause
> > confusion.
> >
> > i agree you should leave ARMD alone. It is well defined and well
> > scoped problem and it is good as it currently is
> >
> > In my humble opinion, the following drafts belong to the CloudOPS WG.
> > Many of them were presented at Cloud BoF in IETF79, and are in the
> > process of getting updated for IETF80. Several are new submissions
> > that are recently uploaded. I think what we have here is more than one
> > and half hours of meeting time JI really do not want to inflict the
> > pain on my ARMD friends.
> >
> > I don't think you are approaching this from the right perspective.
> > This is not about draft, is about real problems and concrete items
> > that you want to work on. You should work on defining a charter, not
> > in voicing for drafts that should be included in a WG that doesn't
> > exist yet.
> >
> > In addition, all this long list seems to cover a too wide variety of
> > topics. I would reccomend to be less ambitious, define a much scoped
> > work, by defining a charter (As opposed to write drafts)
> >
> > my two cents
> >
> > regards, marcelo
> >
> >
> >
> > 1. Cloud Reference Framework 2. Cloud Security Framework 3. VPN
> > Extension for Cloud Services 4. Network Abstraction for Enterprise and
> > SP Class Cloud 5. Protocol Considerations for Workload Mobility in
> > Clouds 6. Service Management for Virtualized Cloud 7. Virtual Network
> > Management Information Model 8. Network Probability Requirements and
> > Models 9. Syslog Extension for Cloud Using Syslog Structured Data 10.
> > Virtual Resource Management (VRM) in Clouds
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Ning So
> >
> > Network Evolution Planning
> >
> > Verizon, Inc.
> >
> > (office) 972-729-7905
> >
> > (Cell) 972-955-0914
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > --
> >
> >  *From:*clouds-bounces@ietf.org <mailto:clouds-bounces@ietf.org>
> > [mailto:clouds-bounces@ietf.org <mailto:clouds-bounces@ietf.org>] *On
> > Behalf Of *Bhumip Khasnabish *Sent:* Thursday, February 10, 2011
> > 11:46 PM *To:* clouds@ietf.org <mailto:clouds@ietf.org> *Subject:*
> > [clouds] Conf call on Friday [11-February-2011] at 10 AM US/NY time
> >
> > Please plan to join a conf call on *Friday, 11-Feb.-2011 starting from
> > 10 AM ET* (New York, USA time)
> >
> > to get updates on the Clouds initiatives/activities.
> >
> > [you may find the current NY/USA time (from your location) at the
> > following URL:
> > http://www.worldtimeserver.com/current_time_in_US-NY.aspx ].
> >
> >
> > Dial in number: *US Toll-free +1-866-710-5490 *If the toll-free number
> > does not work, pls use *+001-203-875-8973* *Passcode: 204
> > 1744*
> >
> > (Thanks to Mr. Ning So for providing the conf bridge).
> >
> > **
> >
> > *_Proposed Agenda:_*
> >
> > **
> >
> > 1. VEPC draft update -- Ning et al 2. CloudLog draft update -- Gene
> > and Sam 3. Data Center Operations (DCOPS) proposal update -- Ross
> > (with info from Ron, if any) 4.
> > draft-rfc-seamless-Cloud-masum-01.txt
> >
> > <http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/app/trac/attachment/wiki/Clouds/draft
> > -rfc-seamless-Cloud-masum-01.txt>(27.1
> >
> >
> KB) – Masum et al, /Network Abstraction for Enterprise and SP
> > class Cloud: Seamless Cloud Abstraction and Interfaces / 5. Protocol
> > Considerations for Workload Mobility in Clouds.txt
> >
> > <http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/app/trac/attachment/wiki/Clouds/Proto
> > col%20Considerations%20for%20Workload%20Mobility%20in%20Clouds.txt>(21
> > .5
> >
> >
> KB) - Masum et al, /Protocol Considerations for Workload
> > Mobility in Clouds / 6.
> > Karavettil-et-al-IETF-Cloud-Security-Framework-11Feb2011_v2.pdf
> >
> > <http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/app/trac/attachment/wiki/Clouds/Karav
> > ettil-et-al-IETF-Cloud-Security-Framework-11Feb2011_v2.pdf>(0.6
> >
> >
> MB) – Suren et al, /updated cloud security framework (CSF)
> > slides / 7. draft-yokota-cloud-service-mobility-01.txt
> >
> > <http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/app/trac/attachment/wiki/Clouds/draft
> > -yokota-cloud-service-mobility-01.txt>(42.0
> >
> >
> KB) – Mr. Yokota et al, /Service Management for Virtualized
> > Networks / 8. Virtual Desktop Infrastructure (VDI) Requirements and
> > Survey update – Mr. Wang and Mr. Ma 9. Cloud (client and network
> > sides) APIs update - Sam 10. VRM update -- Mr Chu et al 11. VDI
> > proposal expectations (further guidance) -- Peter Saint-Andre 12. VDI
> > proposal development -- TBD 13. Any other topics?
> >
> > As always, all of the drafts and presentations are available at the
> > following URL: http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/app/trac/wiki/Clouds
> >
> > *Next conf call*will be held on
> >
> > *_Friday-18-February-2011_**starting from 10 AM ET*(New York, USA
> > time).
> >
> > *Many Thanks for Participation and Contributions.*
> >
> > Best Regards.
> >
> > Bhumip Khasnabish (Mobile:+001-781-752-8003, vumip1 at gmail.com
> > <http://gmail.com/> <mailto:vumip1%20at%20gmail.com
> > <mailto:vumip1%2520at%2520gmail.com>>)
> > http://www.linkedin.com/in/bhumipkhasnabish
> >