Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer?
Paul Wouters <paul@cypherpunks.ca> Tue, 15 May 2012 12:19 UTC
Return-Path: <paul@cypherpunks.ca>
X-Original-To: dane@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dane@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix)
with ESMTP id 55BF821F8925 for <dane@ietfa.amsl.com>;
Tue, 15 May 2012 05:19:27 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.584
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.584 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.015,
BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com
[127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Q3I+2XmwJbBs for
<dane@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 15 May 2012 05:19:26 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from letoams.cypherpunks.ca (bofh.nohats.ca [76.10.157.69]) by
ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C210121F8920 for <dane@ietf.org>;
Tue, 15 May 2012 05:19:26 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by letoams.cypherpunks.ca (Postfix, from userid 500) id C9E27853FE;
Tue, 15 May 2012 08:19:24 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by letoams.cypherpunks.ca
(Postfix) with ESMTP id BFD2A803A3; Tue, 15 May 2012 08:19:24 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Tue, 15 May 2012 08:19:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: Paul Wouters <paul@cypherpunks.ca>
X-X-Sender: paul@bofh.nohats.ca
To: Andrew Sullivan <ajs@anvilwalrusden.com>
In-Reply-To: <20120515112154.GA20521@mail.yitter.info>
Message-ID: <alpine.LFD.2.02.1205150816001.14601@bofh.nohats.ca>
References: <CABcZeBMY26xrfvAx=UsYN2XnuONZ2vPy9tNwHQALudd=yQDvgA@mail.gmail.com>
<643D87CD-D01E-47B8-82E5-D3F57D50C80B@vpnc.org>
<alpine.LFD.2.02.1205142229552.10990@bofh.nohats.ca>
<CABcZeBMS9cJ3m6JwJED7XAqdsF=zbTUUU_o3-opiZvqMyr7mdw@mail.gmail.com>
<alpine.LFD.2.02.1205142352010.10990@bofh.nohats.ca>
<20120515112154.GA20521@mail.yitter.info>
User-Agent: Alpine 2.02 (LFD 1266 2009-07-14)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; format=flowed; charset=US-ASCII
Cc: dane@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer?
X-BeenThere: dane@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: DNS-based Authentication of Named Entities <dane.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dane>,
<mailto:dane-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/dane>
List-Post: <mailto:dane@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dane-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dane>,
<mailto:dane-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 May 2012 12:19:27 -0000
On Tue, 15 May 2012, Andrew Sullivan wrote: >> warnings. It's really the same as disabling TLSA. Or else we're going to >> have to teach browsers to remember previous TLSA state and only warn >> when we knew the site used to publish TLSA, but now we are >> indeterminate. > > Surely, that's just as bad an idea; the fact that the DNS used to > contain a AAAA record is no guide to whether a site is supporting > IPv6 today, by way of analogy. Yes, it is as bad as the cert partrol plugin that tracks PKIX states in a browser. But it's better then disabling TLSA at all in the face of DNS errors (where we assume most errors are genuine network errors and not attacks). Paul
- [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Hoffman
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Hoffman
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Tom Ritter
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Warren Kumari
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Adam Langley
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Hoffman
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Yoav Nir
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Yoav Nir
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Ondrej Mikle
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Warren Kumari
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Hoffman
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Hoffman
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Adam Langley
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Hoffman
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? John Gilmore
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Yoav Nir
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Tony Finch
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Tony Finch
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Tony Finch
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Scott Schmit
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Ondrej Mikle
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Tony Finch
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Ondrej Mikle
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? John Gilmore
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Hoffman
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Hoffman
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Warren Kumari
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Nicholas Weaver
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Warren Kumari
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Warren Kumari
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Warren Kumari
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? John Gilmore
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? John Gilmore
- [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the end-to… John Gilmore
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Mark Andrews
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Martin Rex
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Yoav Nir
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Henry Story
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Henry Story
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… SM
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Michael Richardson
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Eric Rescorla
- Re: [dane] Behavior in the face of no answer? Paul Wouters
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Mark Andrews
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Warren Kumari
- Re: [dane] Network errors ARE attacks - on the en… Phillip Hallam-Baker