Re: [Detnet] New Version Notification for draft-zha-detnet-flow-info-model-02.txt

Hi Rodney,

Thank you for your clarification. I agree with you that DetNet should differentiate these two concepts. Flow identification is needed for sure, and do we need such "flow handle" mechanism in DetNet (layer 3 network)? 

Regards,
Yiyong

-----Original Message-----
From: Rodney Cummings [mailto:rodney.cummings@ni.com] 
Sent: Monday, March 20, 2017 11:39 PM
To: zhayiyong; detnet@ietf.org
Subject: RE: New Version Notification for draft-zha-detnet-flow-info-model-02.txt

Thanks Yiyong,

I would like to clarify something about the 802.1 terminology.

802.1Qcc (and its predecessor 802.1Qat) uses the term "StreamID", and 802.1CB uses the term "Stream identification", and those two terms mean very different things. Given that the two terms do not mean that same thing, it was a mistake to use the same words, but... it is what it is.

For DetNet, I think we need to fix that mistake in the terminology.

For StreamID, I would recommend "flow handle" for DetNet, because that describes its usage more precisely. The StreamID is a unique handle that the user's application (i.e. Talker and Listeners) uses to reference the flow's configuration in the network. For example, the Talker/Listener can use the StreamID to ask "Is my flow ready for use?". The StreamID has nothing to do with data packets between Talker and Listener. It is simply a "GUID". In 802.1 standards, we generate the "GUID" using a MAC address followed by a 16 bit unique identifier generated in the Talker. If DetNet choses to use a different technique to generate a unique identifier, that's fine. This "flow handle" concept has nothing to do with the data packets.

For "Stream identification", 802.1CB uses that term to specify the identification of the Stream in data packets. 802.1CB supports the Stream identifications that the I-D below lists in 3.1.1 and 3.1.2, as well as others. For this term, I would recommend "flow identification" for DetNet, which the I-D below uses.

In 3.1.1 of the I-D below states that 802.1Qcc uses MAC address and unique ID as its flow identification. Technically that is incorrect, because 802.1Qcc uses that encoding for StreamID only (the "flow handle"), and that StreamID encoding is unrelated to data packets. For "flow identification", 802.1Qcc uses the same encodings shown in 3.1.1 and 3.1.2. Those "flow identifications" are actually formalized in 802.1CB.

Rodney

> -----Original Message-----
> From: detnet [mailto:detnet-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of zhayiyong
> Sent: Friday, March 17, 2017 8:32 PM
> To: detnet@ietf.org
> Subject: [Detnet] FW: New Version Notification for 
> draft-zha-detnet-flow- info-model-02.txt
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> Please note that the information model draft has been updated. Changes
> are:
> 1. add transport layer information
> 2. add traffic type information
> 3. more elaboration on how to use it with 802.1qcc 4. editorial 
> changes.
> 
> Regards,
> Yiyong
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org [mailto:internet-drafts@ietf.org]
> Sent: Monday, March 13, 2017 6:10 PM
> To: zhayiyong; Liang Geng; Jiangyuanlong
> Subject: New Version Notification for 
> draft-zha-detnet-flow-info-model- 02.txt
> 
> 
> A new version of I-D, draft-zha-detnet-flow-info-model-02.txt
> has been successfully submitted by Yiyong Zha and posted to the IETF 
> repository.
> 
> Name:		draft-zha-detnet-flow-info-model
> Revision:	02
> Title:		Deterministic Networking Flow Information Model
> Document date:	2017-03-13
> Group:		Individual Submission
> Pages:		15
> URL:            https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-zha-detnet-
> flow-info-model-02.txt
> Status:         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-zha-detnet-flow-
> info-model/
> Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-zha-detnet-flow-info-
> model-02
> Diff:           https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-zha-detnet-flow-
> info-model-02
> 
> Abstract:
>    Deterministic Networking (DetNet) provides end-to-end absolute
>    delay and loss guarantee to serve real-time applications. DetNet
>    is focused on a general approach that use techniques such as 1)
>    data plane resources reservation for DetNet flows; 2) providing
>    fixed path for DetNet flows; 3)sequentializng, replicating, and
>    eliminating duplicate packets transmission [draft-ietf-detnet-
>    architecture-00] to guarantee the worst case delay of DetNet flow
>    while allow sharing among best effort traffic. Data flow
>    information model is important to the DetNet work that it defines
>    information be used by flow establishment and control protocols.
>    This document describes and DetNet flow information model that
>    represents the flow identifier, traffic description information so
>    that can make resource reservation and provide differentiate
>    service.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of 
> submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at 
> tools.ietf.org.
> 
> The IETF Secretariat
> 
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