Re: [Detnet] Data Plane IP, OAM section

"Andrew G. Malis" <agmalis@gmail.com> Wed, 22 May 2019 15:20 UTC

Return-Path: <agmalis@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: detnet@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: detnet@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF0F61201A2 for <detnet@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 22 May 2019 08:20:21 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.998
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7kEBZSaQN9HO for <detnet@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 22 May 2019 08:20:18 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-qt1-x835.google.com (mail-qt1-x835.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::835]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7BCC21201C9 for <detnet@ietf.org>; Wed, 22 May 2019 08:20:18 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-qt1-x835.google.com with SMTP id h1so2842443qtp.1 for <detnet@ietf.org>; Wed, 22 May 2019 08:20:18 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=GOk4wIS0RAKnIfnpiX6SSChuhgGPcSxg7P90vdD9lAQ=; b=gjFCDLyYzm0NSmdhJG03CzJwRizh3y4UsOxbv5xE1YExYrrllBVHHTlw17fxY9CSI1 0MW4euvjCpbHSwDGWnw6GKjBgypHtm97ANfnRWBRdMs2pXZHB1Rnf1rc+/4zgwWD4gNo xPV72UT/eeMBzfTtOyP9YCIktRGrZ7kwnBoDq4VWuWNTw2jgzheSG7bYUz1yZQ5GQ9P8 F1RHVCq+V6t5OA7B31qXoMvH1LnF7AIUbz4wCpdU1dYSDN4FbSkF5de1zxaTrdS3oIen ncSx9V7FtOOsWnyV+TE+fK3W0tjqzs4byZcZBo9fmGigs756oIexxVua9actYTmS7/PM T7qw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=GOk4wIS0RAKnIfnpiX6SSChuhgGPcSxg7P90vdD9lAQ=; b=I2oScCwVHbCylrZ3FFNu2vTxbu4L9HL5YVnVSAdBPtFroEFmEnOEjrY0L/gsj4tvRn NnuRiFUCLCJ8/Lwg9P6n47/I7eGCQaUO3Gsi60piWPb6//NI4lgpKi+7dcz6IaKDDHGU EDjx/HHUs/HJdv86WGBV1FMZQTNTTaHwXD2srw6qOiP5LizL5CtlgmzIj9OxHDmAisq9 FNvLfx+HLHWlxvbQr3Dye6ZvtHbyYotkLktTQEozMhfSVoF0DeqIs39RW8ewScl5OkI+ wNil2KHDXldMlJ5nAMYP14dyPKhvnFWBZ0lNVWfGvaM2kvxmfYg36y0f5ZimfgOy9MnZ ucHA==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWzv4G8dOCNK7m5juDeS4POib08cSiwhmU2pcwE3G99rM7mFyA3 eEybvuVlCnRAp2il5DSb3Op/vDkhIiCDhjPoX7Y=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxB4xKLSIJeDZGBkADnWbnWGSfd76CCawuKxlzQzjfjv7yPEz1s/g2uU4UDfHRnDsZSI5sT0hVRoEwC0tBLhcE=
X-Received: by 2002:ac8:3973:: with SMTP id t48mr74250003qtb.121.1558538417471; Wed, 22 May 2019 08:20:17 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <VI1PR0702MB37905E81A97388508109BC12AC060@VI1PR0702MB3790.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com> <CAA=duU37KN06opoDZDjVnjUF8sgrstZTs3cikUX_tW+BpwK1qg@mail.gmail.com> <75853070-b8ac-19fc-ae37-80d0d2c49c86@pi.nu> <VI1PR0702MB3790EC31C4BEBC7249FE14E6AC070@VI1PR0702MB3790.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com> <CA+RyBmWE4p2axjmB0QneV5rG5YC2PqiFWukLRbxmUaiL8i8Pvw@mail.gmail.com> <760c258a-a8ea-583a-7648-4256b2b34a48@pi.nu> <CA+RyBmUEryYW9rj7kuAaKvJwteX5TQVVNodMGsWFt+tKd++_4g@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CA+RyBmUEryYW9rj7kuAaKvJwteX5TQVVNodMGsWFt+tKd++_4g@mail.gmail.com>
From: "Andrew G. Malis" <agmalis@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 22 May 2019 11:20:06 -0400
Message-ID: <CAA=duU2RFvNiNb3s8tUWH4Q+eiTKW12t7M1remcFHfgfwE+k7A@mail.gmail.com>
To: Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
Cc: Loa Andersson <loa@pi.nu>, Balázs Varga A <balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com>, "detnet@ietf.org" <detnet@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000be080005897b808a"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/detnet/0j-Up46uf7SpzvaboBpFg7kHGkY>
Subject: Re: [Detnet] Data Plane IP, OAM section
X-BeenThere: detnet@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Discussions on Deterministic Networking BoF and Proposed WG <detnet.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/detnet>, <mailto:detnet-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/detnet/>
List-Post: <mailto:detnet@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:detnet-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/detnet>, <mailto:detnet-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 22 May 2019 15:20:29 -0000

Greg,

As the data plane drafts have been separated to focus on each of the
individual data planes, that may be the best course of action for the OAM
drafts as well. If it turns out that there's a reasonable amount of
material that's common between the two, then there can also be a third OAM
Framework draft with the common material, again mirroring the data plane
drafts. Just a thought.

Cheers,
Andy


On Wed, May 22, 2019 at 10:23 AM Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi Loa,
> thank you for your suggestion. Will revive the draft today.
> And I agree with your suggestion to discuss whether we want to have one
> draft for DetNet OAM over all possible variants of the data plane.
>
> Best regards,
> Greg
>
> On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 11:10 PM Loa Andersson <loa@pi.nu> wrote:
>
>> Bala'zs,
>>
>> The draft is expired, that is why it is not shown on the detnet page.
>> Normally  that is a sign that the interest is not that high.
>>
>> Andy,
>>
>> Yes - you are right, but the difference between what we are doing for
>> the MPLS data plane and for the IP data plane was one reason that I
>> asked. Also when checking the draft-mirsky it has a strong MPLS leaning.
>> What was removed from the data plane draft was (the little we have) on
>> IP OAM. draft-mirsky does not add much compared to that.
>>
>> Greg,
>>
>> Please revive the draft, even if you do no other changes, we need it
>> active. That said I'm not sure that we want ONE draft covering both
>> MPLS and IP OAM, it is normally a recipe for delay.
>>
>> All,
>>
>> Once the draft-mirsky is active again, let us decide what we want to do.
>> I see two alternatives
>>
>> First, build on draft-mirsky and create one draft for everything.
>>
>> Second, break the IP OAM out of draft-mirsky and start a new draft for
>> DetNet IP OAM and base the DetNet MPLS OAM in draft-mirsky.
>>
>> I have a slight preference for the second alternative.
>>
>> But make it a wg decision.
>>
>> /Loa
>>
>> On 2019-05-22 01:39, Greg Mirsky wrote:
>> > Hi Balazs,
>> > thank you for pointing to the OAM for DetNet draft. It lapsed and that
>> > may be why is not showing up among other DetNet documents. Mach and I
>> > will work on adding OAM for DetNet over IP data plane. I think it would
>> > be good to use this document for discussion, the definition of OAM for
>> > DetNet over all possible data plane variants. We welcome cooperation
>> and
>> > co-authors.
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> > Greg
>> >
>> > On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 1:43 AM Balázs Varga A
>> > <balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com <mailto:balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com>>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >     Hi Loa,
>> >
>> >     We have a dedicated OAM document:
>> >     https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mirsky-detnet-oam-02
>> >
>> >     Unfortunately not showed among the DetNet documents :--(((
>> >     https://datatracker.ietf.org/group/detnet/documents/
>> >
>> >     Cheers
>> >     Bala'zs
>> >
>> >     -----Original Message-----
>> >     From: detnet <detnet-bounces@ietf.org
>> >     <mailto:detnet-bounces@ietf.org>> On Behalf Of Loa Andersson
>> >     Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2019 8:54 AM
>> >     To: Andrew G. Malis <agmalis@gmail.com <mailto:agmalis@gmail.com>>;
>> >     Balázs Varga A <balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com
>> >     <mailto:balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com>>
>> >     Cc: detnet@ietf.org <mailto:detnet@ietf.org>
>> >     Subject: Re: [Detnet] Data Plane IP, OAM section
>> >
>> >     Bala’zs and Andy,
>> >
>> >     I have no problem removing the OAM section from the data plane
>> >     documents.
>> >
>> >     The question I have is what do we do about the OAM for the specific
>> >     data planes, do we paln separate documents??
>> >
>> >     /Loa
>> >
>> >     On 2019-05-21 00:54, Andrew G. Malis wrote:
>> >      > Balázs,
>> >      >
>> >      > Sounds good, it's just a placeholder right now.
>> >      >
>> >      > Cheers,
>> >      > Andy
>> >      >
>> >      >
>> >      > On Mon, May 20, 2019 at 11:20 AM Balázs Varga A
>> >      > <balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com <mailto:balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com
>> >
>> >     <mailto:balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com
>> >     <mailto:balazs.a.varga@ericsson.com>>> wrote:
>> >      >
>> >      >     Hi,____
>> >      >
>> >      >     __ __
>> >      >
>> >      >     Data plane documents are under review to prepare them for the
>> >      >     workgroup last call.____
>> >      >
>> >      >     OAM section is intended to be removed from the “DetNet Data
>> >     Plane:
>> >      >     IP” document.____
>> >      >
>> >      > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-detnet-ip/____
>> >      >
>> >      >     __ __
>> >      >
>> >      >     Any objections?____
>> >      >
>> >      >     __ __
>> >      >
>> >      >     Cheers____
>> >      >
>> >      >     Bala’zs____
>> >      >
>> >      >     __ __
>> >      >
>> >      >     _______________________________________________
>> >      >     detnet mailing list
>> >      > detnet@ietf.org <mailto:detnet@ietf.org> <mailto:detnet@ietf.org
>> >     <mailto:detnet@ietf.org>>
>> >      > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/detnet
>> >      >
>> >      >
>> >      > _______________________________________________
>> >      > detnet mailing list
>> >      > detnet@ietf.org <mailto:detnet@ietf.org>
>> >      > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/detnet
>> >      >
>> >
>> >     --
>> >
>> >
>> >     Loa Andersson                        email: loa@pi.nu <mailto:
>> loa@pi.nu>
>> >     Senior MPLS Expert
>> >     Bronze Dragon Consulting             phone: +46 739 81 21 64
>> >
>> >     _______________________________________________
>> >     detnet mailing list
>> >     detnet@ietf.org <mailto:detnet@ietf.org>
>> >     https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/detnet
>> >     _______________________________________________
>> >     detnet mailing list
>> >     detnet@ietf.org <mailto:detnet@ietf.org>
>> >     https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/detnet
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > detnet mailing list
>> > detnet@ietf.org
>> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/detnet
>> >
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> Loa Andersson                        email: loa@pi.nu
>> Senior MPLS Expert
>> Bronze Dragon Consulting             phone: +46 739 81 21 64
>>
>