Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-detnet-mpls-over-udp-ip-07: (with DISCUSS)
Magnus Westerlund <magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com> Thu, 03 December 2020 09:13 UTC
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From: Magnus Westerlund <magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com>
To: "iesg@ietf.org" <iesg@ietf.org>, "balazs.a.varga=40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org" <balazs.a.varga=40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, "David.Black@dell.com" <David.Black@dell.com>
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Thread-Topic: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-detnet-mpls-over-udp-ip-07: (with DISCUSS)
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Date: Thu, 03 Dec 2020 09:13:17 +0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/detnet/TFYLBHEiq64Rqp64IOKYwVOGxsc>
Subject: Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-detnet-mpls-over-udp-ip-07: (with DISCUSS)
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Hi, David's suggestions is definitely the direction I was considering to resolve this. Cheers Magnus On Wed, 2020-12-02 at 22:40 +0000, Black, David wrote: > Hi Balazs, > > Digging in a little deeper, I concur with Magnus's underlying concern that > this draft ought to say something about UDP checksums with IPv6. There's a > useful starting point at the end of the Introduction (Section 1): > > As specified in [RFC7510]: "MPLS-in-UDP MUST NOT be used over the > general Internet, or over non-cooperating network operators, to carry > traffic that is not congestion controlled." This does apply to > DetNet networks as this document focuses on solutions for networks > that are under a single administrative control or within a closed > group of administrative control. > > That suggests that the first two exceptions (a & b) in Section 3.1 of RFC > 7510 (both of which involve single administrative control) are more likely to > apply to DetNet than the third one (c, based on higher layer recovery and/or > error tolerance). It could be helpful to say that in an added paragraph on > UDP checksums (for both v4 and v6) at the end of Section 4 in this draft. > > I would also suggest aligning the text quoted above (from the end of Section > 1) with the text used in exceptions a. & b. in Section 3.1 of RFC 7510, as I > think roughly the same scope is intended. In particular, it appears to me > that this draft's notion of "closed group of administrative control" would > fall under the notion of "single administrative control" in RFC 7510 (FWIW, > I'm an author of RFC 7510). > > The suggestion to add use/non-use of UDP checksum to the list of management > and control information in Section 5 is a good idea - that addition ought to > cite Section 3.1 of RFC 7510 for the conditions under which the UDP checksum > may be disabled for IPv6 (per RFC 7510, UDP checksum for IPv6 "MUST be > implemented" for MPLS-in-UDP). > > Thanks, --David > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: detnet <detnet-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Balázs Varga A > > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 12:25 PM > > To: Magnus Westerlund; The IESG > > Cc: eagros@dolby.com; detnet@ietf.org; draft-ietf-detnet-mpls-over-udp- > > ip@ietf.org; detnet-chairs@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-detnet-mpls- > > over- > > udp-ip-07: (with DISCUSS) > > > > > > [EXTERNAL EMAIL] > > > > Hi, > > > > Chapter 5. of draft-ietf-detnet-mpls-over-udp-ip provides a _non-exhaustive_ > > list of > > control and management plane information. > > DetNet does not changes rules of rfc7510: if the exceptions listed in 3.1 of > > rfc7510 > > applies, then using zero checksum is allowed; otherwise not. > > > > A possible solution can be to add an additional information element to the > > list in > > chapter 5, which allow or not the usage of zero-checksum. > > > > Thanks & Cheers > > Bala'zs > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: detnet <detnet-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Magnus Westerlund via > > Datatracker > > Sent: Wednesday, December 2, 2020 4:47 PM > > To: The IESG <iesg@ietf.org> > > Cc: eagros@dolby.com; detnet@ietf.org; draft-ietf-detnet-mpls-over-udp- > > ip@ietf.org; detnet-chairs@ietf.org > > Subject: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-detnet-mpls- > > over-udp- > > ip-07: (with DISCUSS) > > > > Magnus Westerlund has entered the following ballot position for > > draft-ietf-detnet-mpls-over-udp-ip-07: Discuss > > > > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email > > addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this > > introductory > > paragraph, however.) > > > > > > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html > > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > > > > > > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-detnet-mpls-over-udp-ip/ > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > DISCUSS: > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > So there might be something missing here in regards to zero-checksum in UDP > > when using IPv6. So Section 3.1 in RFC 7510 discusses this for MPLS over UDP > > and > > have some considerations that needs to be done if one are intending to use > > zero > > checksum. To me it appears that DETNET flows can not be guaranteed to always > > fulfill these, and in case you think you can motivate it should probably be > > stated > > explicitly and normatively allow it. So if it can't be guaranteed to fulfill > > these > > requirements then the next question exists: Do the possibility to use zero- > > checksum > > for this flow become something the control plane needs to signal it? > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > detnet mailing list > > detnet@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/detnet > > > > _______________________________________________ > > detnet mailing list > > detnet@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/detnet
- [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-iet… Magnus Westerlund via Datatracker
- Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft… Balázs Varga A
- Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft… Black, David
- Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft… Magnus Westerlund
- Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft… Stewart Bryant
- Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft… Black, David
- Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft… Stewart Bryant
- Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft… Balázs Varga A
- Re: [Detnet] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft… Magnus Westerlund