Re: [Dime] OC-Supported Feature AVP

"Wiehe, Ulrich (NSN - DE/Munich)" <> Tue, 17 December 2013 10:15 UTC

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From: "Wiehe, Ulrich (NSN - DE/Munich)" <>
Thread-Topic: OC-Supported Feature AVP
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Subject: Re: [Dime] OC-Supported Feature AVP
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Hi JJacques,

ad A)
I support to mandate a) for applications that do and also for applications that do not maintain state, because:
                for applications that do not maintain state: "if the OC-Supported-Features AVP is no more present in a message (and in later messages) ,  it would  be interpreted  that DOIC is no more supported"     and
                for applications that maintain state: State is maintained at session endpoints which are not necessarily DOIC endpoints.

With regard to SequenceNumber it has been argued that
we could have a situation where the OC-Feature-Vector remain unchanged but some additional AVPs related to the supported features would change
however, we should cross the bridge when we come to it , e.g. the additional AVP, when introduced, could be of type grouped with a sequence number as first component.

Ad B)
Advertisement (OC-Supported-Features AVP in request messages) followed by selection (OC-OLR AVP in answer messages) is a good approach. I never understood why we need the  OC-Supported-Features AVP in answer messages as long as no extension is defined.


Sent: Friday, December 13, 2013 2:45 PM
Subject: [Dime] OC-Supported Feature AVP

Dear all

When analysing the discussion of the sequence number in the OC-Supported-Features AVP , it has driven me to some other considerations regarding this  feature negotiation that I hereafter present:  it is a bit long but it raises  a certain number of questions   and then we have to draw some conclusion  and adapt the text  of the draft if needed

A)     Behaviours for sending the  OC-Supported-Features AVP

Currently there is only one default algorithm. So the use of  OC-Supported-Features AVP containing the OC-Feature-Vector is  only to indicate the support of DOIC with the default algorithm, given that en entity not supporting DOIC will never sends the OC-Supported-Features AVP.

This AVP in the future  will allow to add new feature/capabilities .

This AVP is needed initially to advertise the mutual  capabilities between reacting and reporting node  and  when changes occur in the  supported  features (eg in general to add a new feature, but may be also to remove  one). A sequence number was introduced to manage these changes, but this introduction is still under discussion (cf Ulrich's mails questioning this point)

Then there is the question about when the OC-Supported-Features AVP is sent.  The current draft  has related statements in 3.2 and 4.1  :

The several hereafter possible  behaviors are compliant for me with 3.2 and 4.1  statements (are you sharing this reading?), we have to see if the draft allows all of them or if additional rules must be  fulfilled:

a)      The reacting node sends the OC-Supported-Features AVP in each request and the reporting node sends back its own OC-Supported-Features AVP in each answer.

b)      The reacting nodes initially sends its  OC-Supported-Features AVP, but does not repeat it any more , until a change in the features to be advertised  happens or after a node restart

c)       Something intermediate, so when there is a change as in b)  plus  a periodic advertisement of the supported features although unchanged

About a):

Steve,  and I agree,   indicated that the features are quite stable over time, and modifications will appear when a new feature is deployed (OAM case); I think  it is also needed at restart. So there are very few events over the year where the advertisement is actually needed (have you others in mind?) . Now my questioning:   why to permanently do such an exchange in each request/answer?  I observe that this behavior  is used in 3GPP where supported features are advertised in each request/answer, so we can apply  the same principle, but I nevertheless raise the question.

About the sequence number:

o   the receiving node has to open the sequence number AVP and checks if it has changed, given the value will change only a few times a year.  A besides  question,  which value the seq number takes after a restart

o   if we do not use the sequence number, the  receiving node has to open the OC-feature-Vector AVP and see if it has changed, so I do not see much difference with the above

o   the sequence number has the property  to be equal  or to increase in order to detect an eventual  change of the order of the messages and avoid to come back to a previous value of the feature-vector. But further messages will all be with the new feature-vector, so the right result. I am not sure that the seq number bring a value for the transient period when the supported feature is  modified. So question: can we suppress the seq number in this a) behaviour?
In this a ) behaviour, if the OC-Supported-Features AVP is no more present in a message (and in later messages) ,  it would  be interpreted  that DOIC is no more supported . ( so different from the b) or c) case)

About b): this is the other extreme use case compared to a).

Here in practice all the messages will not contain an  OC-Supported-Features AVP (except in the  rare cases of a change or after a restart), So the absence of this AVP in a message  does not mean that DOIC is not supported. Capability negotiation  happens once and remain valid until a change. At restart or when a change  a reacting node sends an OC-Supported-Features AVP in a request, and wait for an OC-Supported-Features AVP   in the answer; if nothing, it means the reporting node is not supporting DOIC. If the answer is lost the reacting node may repeat the request or use another one with its OC Supported-feature AVP.

If the change occurs in the reporting node, it cannot wait for a request coming from the reacting node with an OC Supported-feature AVP,  (as it will  never come if no change at the reacting node side), so the reporting node should advertise the  OC Supported-feature AVP in answers (although the corresponding request do not contain this AVP).  I think this behavior is currently allowed by the draft text, do you agree?.   To secure a bit more, the reacting node may then  send a request with its own OC Supported-feature AVP, acting as an acknowledgement to the reporting node. The reporting node may repeat if needed  or to be more secure.

There may be some corner cases to investigate more, but I currently stop here.

In this use case, I do not see a need  for a sequence number .

Do you think such an approach is applicable? it will save many checks compared to a).

About c): it is the same principle as in b) but with some periodic  "refresh" that may make the a) approach  still more secure. But not sure  it is actually needed.

So do you think the draft should  allow these different  behaviors  or only mandate one?

Then do you think we need a sequence number for the OC-Supported-Features AVP?

B)      Another point also related to the OC-Supported-Features AVP and OC-Feature-Vector:

For example a node can use the default mechanism  and in addition support extensions (eg the APN or the session group examples). I would think extensions should be advertized by the reacting node , otherwise the server does not know if it can use an extension or not, and  a server should avoid  to send OLRs that the client will not understand .
 So here we may have  a set of extensions compatible with the default mechanism

The other example is "exclusive" or not compatible features, for example Traffic reduction %control  and rate control. I do not consider  a reporting node  will  use both with a reacting node. A reacting node , even if it supports both does not want to mix  throttling based on % traffic and throttling on rate control with the same reporting node. But the current  text does not say anything about which feature is selected .
I remember that in our initial discussions, the reacting node was advertising its features / capabilities and the reporting node was selecting the ones it wants to use. Should not we come back to this rule? or do you consider that when we will introduce new features , we will introduce statements  to indicate rules on their presence in OC-Feature-Vector. Personnaly, I think  the advertisement  followed  by selection  was a good approach. Views on this?

I have  described this B part  here, as it may have some interaction with the  A part.

Best regards