Re: [Din] Workshop on Centralization -- Final Agenda
Dirk Kutscher <ietf@dkutscher.net> Thu, 03 June 2021 18:57 UTC
Return-Path: <ietf@dkutscher.net>
X-Original-To: din@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: din@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A28223A145F for <din@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 3 Jun 2021 11:57:06 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.897
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aczBldoaLhhC for <din@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 3 Jun 2021 11:57:01 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mout.kundenserver.de (mout.kundenserver.de [212.227.17.24]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 031CE3A145C for <din@irtf.org>; Thu, 3 Jun 2021 11:57:00 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.4.182] ([95.89.115.52]) by mrelayeu.kundenserver.de (mreue109 [212.227.15.183]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 1MplPf-1l1EHd34BR-00qD9m for <din@irtf.org>; Thu, 03 Jun 2021 20:56:56 +0200
From: Dirk Kutscher <ietf@dkutscher.net>
To: din@irtf.org
Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2021 20:56:52 +0200
X-Mailer: MailMate (1.14r5757)
Message-ID: <4C585F33-24D7-49DF-BFE9-6255E9CA081C@dkutscher.net>
In-Reply-To: <A164CAB7-C592-41CB-B010-20581E3D96BE@dkutscher.net>
References: <A164CAB7-C592-41CB-B010-20581E3D96BE@dkutscher.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_MailMate_EA48E391-5294-4F22-BB7B-0AF6C2E513A7_="
X-Provags-ID: V03:K1:JXMxr8LEydJrY72Z+dNtACVvTKqgL5qB95aefRtHqWtkftw/tea wju1SixUQNl7+XWjCAf7v4uUaZ7N7Hc80gWJttA4ITeGyost4TXUcAel9GpWoYZUHII9huw szLHMLpkjgxfsB7PGBroRcmL37mL7sGXlXE4G0vvEKVXPXrnn4B9jBpS7DiBMjS1y6C8YaR S1I4GPQU9RQMONEKOrHMg==
X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V03:K0:mSwwhmUN84E=:AyA2XErYPzI5ALCwQ/1N7B dDpIXIe3T1VwRwaqFh4Zal4zYT1ic8KdA6JFiH/+X6XMEGdBS2tes4WKSHyzEoyCzHC31tQk0 Jtx2duykUlaPeJ3aHsuZuVanyX+JZG1jP38ad8H5kgxnUOauP7qOpEvSUIAgwKenVRCmaF0gS CjfzNfDUoy/5xBMXlIYl13O8OANt0Mgk7IpY9EgAMJ5Lu6C7qnIoFE46nUHA0zVUvZ6W/yBkr Oxjchjwwp4v1QKL8db6y1r/7HXC1tPDJPBm+bYocSwlRN7qwBrdB6M+VNMhzEcWnIF+vMHKJb gcgh09iecCyhsKD7/MfK6nlqO2BGjIbTCgBRjlwWnazGQWK8rokw6eNM++24zjDmc792Ltozl eFl70pzuIUOLtk1h+hO/t4ZcWW7qPVkJTGt54kz3l0746BTBnlIG8KAf5/gP+9ESPgUQ0cv9v Fk2/L0t9b/E7nQ02p7JC9Ujp4s5OhjtLsuLBRFvtpxhzf1DinQ6zvu4OXcjxKEXPGvMVVRbej gb/IlPAe4x3Rvuz8SxS0Tk=
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/din/0C4TYEAPfuSFM4hGQ_8I72OM1bA>
Subject: Re: [Din] Workshop on Centralization -- Final Agenda
X-BeenThere: din@irtf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Discussion of distributed Internet Infrastructure approaches, aspects such as Service Federation, and underlying technologies" <din.irtf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/options/din>, <mailto:din-request@irtf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/din/>
List-Post: <mailto:din@irtf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:din-request@irtf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/din>, <mailto:din-request@irtf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2021 18:57:07 -0000
Hello, if you are asked for an account to access the MeetEcho session, please try to create one at https://datatracker.ietf.org (User...) if you don't have an account yet. Let us know in case there are problems. Dirk On 1 Jun 2021, at 22:22, Dirk Kutscher wrote: > DINRG Workshop (Interim Meeting) on the Centralization in the Internet > ====================================================================== > > - June 3rd, 19:00 UTC to 22:00 UTC > - > [MeetEcho](https://meetings.conf.meetecho.com/interim/?short=ed3b91f7-04e0-4cdb-9477-f1014f5ca47b) > - [Meeting > Materials](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/session/dinrg) > - [Meeting Notes and > Bluesheet](https://codimd.ietf.org/irtf-dinrg-interim-2021-06-03) > > Agenda > ------ > > | | | | | > |-----|--------------------------------------|-------------|--------| > | 1 | Welcome and Introduction | Chairs | 15 min | > | 2 | Panel \#1: WHY: Is Big Really Bad? | | 60 min | > | 3 | Break | | 15 min | > | 3 | Panel \#2: HOW: How Did We Get Here? | | 60 min | > | 4 | Open Discussion: Feedback, Thoughts | Chairs, All | 30 min | > > ### Panel \#1: WHY: Is Big Really Bad? > > #### Topics > > - Economic, societal, regulation perspective > - Centralization in the Internet and Elsewhere > > #### Intro Talk: Geoff Huston > > #### Panel > > - Dirk Kutscher (Moderator) > - Henning Schulzrinne > - Dominique Lazanski > - Geoff Huston > > ### Panel \#2: HOW: How Did We Get Here? > > #### Topics > > - Architectural & technical discussion > - Factors enabling centralization? > > #### Intro Talk: Christian Huitema > > #### Panel: > > - Lixia Zhang (Moderator) > - Thomas Hardjono > - Jari Arkko > - Trinh Viet Doan > - Christian Huitema > > Motivation > ---------- > > The networking community generally seems to agree that the Internet > consolidation and centralization trend has progressed rapidly over the > last few years, bringing impactful societal and economical > consequences. > To counter that trend, multiple studies and activities have been > launched to decentralize the Internet and the Web (for example see > https://blog.mozilla.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/IHPbriefs\_decentralization\_March\_2017.pdf, > https://solidproject.org/, and https://www.decentralizedweb.net/, plus > various Blockchain-inspired approaches). > > When the internet started as a completely decentralized system 40 > years > back, at that time perhaps few people, if any, could have foreseen > where > it is today. How did we get from there to here? What is driving > aggregation and centralization in the Internet? What are the > implications for industry actors and technology as well as for > users/consumers? > > We believe that a good understanding of this question could make a > good > first step towards understanding whether it is possible/feasible, and > if > so, how, to steer the Internet away from centralization. > > Objectives > ---------- > > The objective of this workshop is to start an open discussion on the > above question to help clearly characterize centralization in the > Internet and to discuss its root causes. That is, before jumping to > discussing various potential solutions, we suggest taking a step back > and discussing how we got from there to here, and what were the > driving > forces and enablers at each stage. > > We believe that a sound and evidence-based understanding is of key > importance for devising any effective form of remedy and action plan. > In > particular, we would like to foster an understanding on the > relationship > of architectural properties and economic developments. For example, > > - whether any architectural features, or lack of them, made an > impact > on the internet ecosystem developments and business models; and > - from a retrospective view, was there anything that might have been > done differently, to have an impact on the course the Internet has > taken? > > This is a complex problem with many relevant factors (technical and > economic) and historic developments, so we would like to invite > contributions on all of these aspects to this first workshop which may > likely lead to further in-depth follow-up discussion. A result of this > workshop could indeed be a more substantiated agenda for more focused > future research in DINRG. > > Workshop Submissions > -------------------- > > This is the input that was submitted before the workshop. Thanks to > all > contributors! > > 1. [Measuring Web Centralization, Trinh Viet > Doan](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-measuring-web-centralization-trinh-viet-doan-00) > 2. [Centralization is about Control, not Protocols, Henning > Schulzrinne](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-centralization-is-about-control-not-protocols-henning-schulzrinne-00) > 3. [Protocol and Engineering Effects of Consolidation, Dominique > Lazanski](https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lazanski-consolidation/) > 4. [Centrality in the Internet, Geoff > Huston](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-centrality-in-the-internet-geoff-huston-00) > 5. [We are probably doomed to Internet consolidation, but we should > still try do something., Christian > Huitema](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-we-are-probably-doomed-christian-huitema-00) > 6. [How We Got from There to Here: Searching for the Root Cause, > Lixia > Zhang](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-searching-for-the-root-cause-lixia-zhang-00) > 7. [Mitigation Options against Centralization in DNS Resolvers, Jari > Arkko](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-mitigation-options-against-centralization-in-dns-resolvers-jari-arkko-00) > 8. [Decentralization != Equality?, Trinh Viet > Doan](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-decentralization-equality-trinh-viet-doan-00) > 9. [Decentralized Data Infrastructures for the New Digital Economy, > Thomas > Hardjono](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-decentralized-data-infrastructures-for-the-new-digital-economy-thomas-hardjono-00) > 10. [Autonomy is the real goal, Phillip > Hallam-Baker](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-autonomy-is-the-real-goal-phillip-hallam-baker-00) > 11. [Focus on Standards Adoption, Charles > Eckels](https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/interim-2021-dinrg-01/materials/slides-interim-2021-dinrg-01-sessa-focus-on-standards-adoption-charles-eckels-00) > _______________________________________________ > Din mailing list > Din@irtf.org > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/din
- [Din] Workshop on Centralization -- Final Agenda Dirk Kutscher
- Re: [Din] Workshop on Centralization -- Final Age… Dirk Kutscher
- Re: [Din] Workshop on Centralization -- Final Age… Dirk Kutscher