IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [dmarc-ietf] Forensic report loops are a problem

"Murray S. Kucherawy" <superuser@gmail.com> Thu, 28 January 2021 20:59 UTC

Return-Path: <superuser@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 533A03A1755 for <dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 12:59:50 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.097
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ew8xbVjBWFKx for <dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 12:59:49 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-vs1-xe2c.google.com (mail-vs1-xe2c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e2c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E33393A1751 for <dmarc@ietf.org>; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 12:59:48 -0800 (PST)
Received: by mail-vs1-xe2c.google.com with SMTP id s83so1408596vsc.4 for <dmarc@ietf.org>; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 12:59:48 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=pHKavKndYEaa0zwj/n+dganQT06P1kIFQHPpFiBGZuo=; b=bdfkBd7iY/qcqeszwrMYt+WAppVvOEBVwSFIBMGElRX2DKTGMC6lSzimcfGFrlFQOc Fw+TYO1tevTJonIwFuSydFvxJuhVAcCt+d5j50t8isL8z3+Vn02mgVLbzTZK5ESvOVSW K5ccIU/Qg4tGccsEIOaJlt3VHBoIf1Yxshg9JWbU1EXS/cam2oaYqcgX2RNGlyQeisq/ ZE/lKLqveet6bjAcqq21VI88KIZvsABeJzWMGhrjDteC34ZI+FYcNogPnAIqEvX/RdhF 5vnuMcUfRIFscT/DQC0mubUXq5+w2nvw5tPdn84mIyVrVtnlICU+6ZZQrmOzLnXcNLCi FaRg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=pHKavKndYEaa0zwj/n+dganQT06P1kIFQHPpFiBGZuo=; b=d6Rn9Qv2OOp96lTcrOdeMEy3WVCMc4W194VNCzU3+ZDFBYbVxijjCcYYvqeNmrEgvq /Bt9oVSYTGxoVuyfVzbA/kEchGDh0OB/5d7QkHmWbNMzbNB8zxiyZXCW7wPkqCIfSVrs JeUKhSjX3lQ+a0oaAsjCdbi7uQ5s4mq6rXQSAEVPgy9HNsQbPIvu89NoR8tKKMn7sxBW 3d68ZkZFwYDiENAYjzedInnMLA8f92QGlEoKu8YqEFCYdyjzoOD6a607s8E/JvKR775w 5qHxORUODNM9HigxZziUL1+V/nPspb9iRtryLBeC88Z6h8GVyxtEg3UwkRTZYRflV5hi QWaA==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532Rw9pJqb2BIgffNYwT2dablek6R+7x1892ADxBdx6Otfp3yv0O kFIQwKRRgr5KAuUXUvevhMH2zdfvHX2UXO8LhTn439oP86o=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyNdYOWLMUTudR/Nw9gZtM0RN1oyAiK6HXvdjdVXKJbihQ8SXvJuHu2YPNmS1umJGTEEa3+oPr17zFDI61c04M=
X-Received: by 2002:a67:18c6:: with SMTP id 189mr1310287vsy.54.1611867587710; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 12:59:47 -0800 (PST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <CAL0qLwY5BbwvS9XXqBk=Mp074ntN=NeS97pJAxPBdQEZAsgohg@mail.gmail.com> <20210127203714.007C86CDB9CA@ary.qy> <CAL0qLwbN+HkGfvw79rPPvqL6jWWAsUtWY9X1gW=vAvoeQS8RHg@mail.gmail.com> <526bf4d5-5a7d-5a91-b965-36ffeab933f7@taugh.com>
In-Reply-To: <526bf4d5-5a7d-5a91-b965-36ffeab933f7@taugh.com>
From: "Murray S. Kucherawy" <superuser@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 12:59:36 -0800
Message-ID: <CAL0qLwb3Z6DbVCvhSF=G6dxjoYwjLvwzbG0OOAUbD=F8H6+wyg@mail.gmail.com>
To: John R Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
Cc: IETF DMARC WG <dmarc@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000fd92f505b9fc2ac0"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dmarc/CN43LDpqiLM9ZqbHVafrkjjWh6g>
Subject: Re: [dmarc-ietf] Forensic report loops are a problem
X-BeenThere: dmarc@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Domain-based Message Authentication, Reporting, and Compliance \(DMARC\)" <dmarc.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dmarc>, <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dmarc/>
List-Post: <mailto:dmarc@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmarc>, <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2021 20:59:50 -0000

On Wed, Jan 27, 2021 at 7:08 PM John R Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:

> Which of these should we do:
>
> A) Everyone in the world who produces failure reports adds special cases
> to look for incoming failure reports, and heuristics to try and recognize
> failure reports in the wrong format, and when it finds one of them, it
> makes a note not to send a failure report about it.
>
> B) Someone slaps me upside the head and I fix my SPF record so my reports
> are sent correctly.
>

I'm suggesting:

C) Stipulate somehow that generated reports should not contain data about
received reports.  (If you do that, then you likely obviate the need to
generate a new report back to that operator in the first place.)

This to me is almost exactly the same thing as saying "Don't generate a
bounce about a bounce", which has been part of SMTP for decades (it's a
SHOULD NOT in 2821).  I don't understand why you're saying it's appropriate
in one but a non-issue in the other.

-MSK

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email