Re: [dmarc-ietf] Abolishing DMARC policy quarantine

Hector Santos <hsantos@isdg.net> Wed, 12 June 2019 14:41 UTC

Return-Path: <hsantos@isdg.net>
X-Original-To: dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3BCA120123 for <dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 07:41:48 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.001
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.001 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=isdg.net header.b=C7UDCT67; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=beta.winserver.com header.b=eWnuKapc
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1yRslxdFjHOV for <dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 07:41:46 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail.winserver.com (ntbbs.santronics.com [76.245.57.69]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B948212011C for <dmarc@ietf.org>; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 07:41:45 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; d=isdg.net; s=tms1; a=rsa-sha1; c=simple/relaxed; l=998; t=1560350501; atps=ietf.org; atpsh=sha1; h=Received:Received:Received:Received:Message-ID:Date:From: Organization:To:Subject:List-ID; bh=wTZPsOHORlmE5FETJAnDDI1AvvA=; b=C7UDCT673rL+NFr9xSxK/ZajOf5CrIoaXYa9xeJOL1iz7IfDdqZ9t8nmtZ/6+K /Gr/aWnc8XDhYrqCe2tnl+E710ckIg7jGu7KeLmdCyCLiu/8gobaLUj1Zsi498Rg YFUU6tUh3UAXUvnNHsLdKzzp0wwCC4wqZtD5CM3f/AHcE=
Received: by winserver.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v8.0.454.8) for dmarc@ietf.org; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 10:41:41 -0400
Authentication-Results: dkim.winserver.com; dkim=pass header.d=beta.winserver.com header.s=tms1 header.i=beta.winserver.com;
Received: from beta.winserver.com ([76.245.57.74]) by winserver.com (Wildcat! SMTP v8.0.454.8) with ESMTP id 1142940765.1.5076; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 10:41:41 -0400
DKIM-Signature: v=1; d=beta.winserver.com; s=tms1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/relaxed; l=998; t=1560350304; h=Received:Received: Message-ID:Date:From:Organization:To:Subject:List-ID; bh=nNvhk9p 2DqI5zDM38XXAA/xwf1Pg3f+mLnpoJEWemU0=; b=eWnuKapck+UKrhbP0m+pbNw FzuNYXxQt9E8ZwwLd8FzVwBuwyX93KBf0+xOBB5bFVakrnb1s9EKY5/+eE7/3XmQ GQ1QPq6WM+kkBLijqqA0OxnEUJALwIjhB2QRglb8Df0HAX+7ZYwoqyxHcwSJqvhT X3bRIJ9fdhk44kbuNjro=
Received: by beta.winserver.com (Wildcat! SMTP Router v8.0.454.8) for dmarc@ietf.org; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 10:38:24 -0400
Received: from [192.168.1.68] ([75.26.216.248]) by beta.winserver.com (Wildcat! SMTP v8.0.454.8) with ESMTP id 2715159520.9.44848; Wed, 12 Jun 2019 10:38:23 -0400
Message-ID: <5D010F28.5020506@isdg.net>
Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2019 10:41:44 -0400
From: Hector Santos <hsantos@isdg.net>
Reply-To: hsantos@isdg.net
Organization: Santronics Software, Inc.
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.8.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: dmarc@ietf.org
References: <a8ac130a671f5bcd1bf9f09781325e84a9f1fda6.camel@aegee.org> <5D00FDFA.8040303@isdg.net> <4B7278AE-7AFC-4183-A879-644D4F9AAB69@wordtothewise.com> <CAJ4XoYeZ2J4pW2=kKRxfXES4V=7A9-P+E+VdW-DuB6_xgBMwLQ@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAJ4XoYeZ2J4pW2=kKRxfXES4V=7A9-P+E+VdW-DuB6_xgBMwLQ@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dmarc/FN6KSD2moHJb91X1Atnm_kCMzJI>
Subject: Re: [dmarc-ietf] Abolishing DMARC policy quarantine
X-BeenThere: dmarc@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Domain-based Message Authentication, Reporting, and Compliance \(DMARC\)" <dmarc.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dmarc>, <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dmarc/>
List-Post: <mailto:dmarc@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmarc>, <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2019 14:41:49 -0000

On 6/12/2019 9:49 AM, Dotzero wrote:
>
>     Given that the 5322.from is crucial for DMARC, and the 5322.from
>     is transmitted after DATA, how can you evaluate DMARC before DATA?
>
> You can't evaluate DMARC before DATA.

Sure you can. I explained how it can be explored today!

Right now, today, it can explored with an existing protocol just was 
recently made historic:

https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc4405

The status change was done because this protocol was part of the 
SenderID vs SPF experiment and SenderID lost.  SPF was made a standard 
track protocol.   It does not mean we could not consider leveraging 
the exist SUBMITTER code for other purposes and its a right fit for a 
high overhead payload technology in DMARC. I will suggest it can offer 
a high optimization payoff:

   - Eliminate payload reception overhead, yet still
   - Provide DMARC reporting and disposition override capabilities.

I don't think its an "Horrible Idea."  I think its a great idea. :)

-- 
HLS