Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #1 - SPF alignment

Alessandro Vesely <vesely@tana.it> Mon, 01 February 2021 16:59 UTC

Return-Path: <vesely@tana.it>
X-Original-To: dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D852F3A12E3 for <dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 1 Feb 2021 08:59:39 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.121
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.121 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1152-bit key) header.d=tana.it
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id p_laHOd3evGk for <dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 1 Feb 2021 08:59:38 -0800 (PST)
Received: from wmail.tana.it (wmail.tana.it [62.94.243.226]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6E5CE3A12D8 for <dmarc@ietf.org>; Mon, 1 Feb 2021 08:59:37 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tana.it; s=delta; t=1612198776; bh=urgQDQAhrhxX0xSRldP7DngElmqVd7Udx5zdT84ZyxQ=; l=757; h=To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=DCBkPTPp0Kgt53jfv9RHVfAdh5sIW5SnAmNwgAdZPi4PPiSVL1X+rpCFIrdriE5oZ 34lpQPrTbElaRCK8VOR/X91QMpV0wnrCIW+kKQzVNGC5deApCPKNyX7QzPp/zjjC/w TNH+i8N+5dqAEpPZgJGUEsLHe9EWaZi/wgTQHLdhJj5kFjfUAJkZdZt84wl6v
Authentication-Results: tana.it; auth=pass (details omitted)
Original-From: Alessandro Vesely <vesely@tana.it>
Received: from [172.25.197.111] (pcale.tana [172.25.197.111]) (AUTH: CRAM-MD5 uXDGrn@SYT0/k, TLS: TLS1.3, 128bits, ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) by wmail.tana.it with ESMTPSA id 00000000005DC028.0000000060183378.00003C7E; Mon, 01 Feb 2021 17:59:36 +0100
To: Douglas Foster <dougfoster.emailstandards@gmail.com>, IETF DMARC WG <dmarc@ietf.org>
References: <20210130212339.447316D04763@ary.qy> <36a1c70-875d-89c8-7e95-a32324654275@taugh.com> <CAH48ZfwBKyA-TwSrr2422zmMO8wr1CKf2MiQZ3KvQu2hOH=_CA@mail.gmail.com> <1654196.ygyh55z74P@zini-1880> <babf1538-5172-f101-d5e4-c4fa33dea495@tana.it> <CAH48ZfzAEhxSgS=VZtsp-xdWMzKq0Zow7DyCALq=qvMAv8_mEQ@mail.gmail.com>
From: Alessandro Vesely <vesely@tana.it>
Message-ID: <90e67edb-1433-41b4-1027-c0bb853b5a9f@tana.it>
Date: Mon, 1 Feb 2021 17:59:34 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.6.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <CAH48ZfzAEhxSgS=VZtsp-xdWMzKq0Zow7DyCALq=qvMAv8_mEQ@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dmarc/LSypRcOIZXf5A9NO0Zbp9xbPZzE>
Subject: Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #1 - SPF alignment
X-BeenThere: dmarc@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Domain-based Message Authentication, Reporting, and Compliance \(DMARC\)" <dmarc.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dmarc>, <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dmarc/>
List-Post: <mailto:dmarc@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmarc>, <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Feb 2021 16:59:40 -0000

On Mon 01/Feb/2021 15:26:37 +0100 Douglas Foster wrote:
> 
> If Helo aligns with From, it says that the mail server has permission to send 
> on behalf of the From domain, but it does not justify using a different domain 
> in the SMTP address.   If the SMTP address is null, this is not a problem.   If 
> it is not null and is different from the HELO domain, we have permitted domain 
> abuse.


Who said a different MAIL FROM is abusive?  What if I have an account at gmail 
and, for convenience, prefer to collect bounces at that mailbox?  Would I need 
a special permission to do so?

What if helo is verified, bounce address is null, but there is a DKIM-Signature 
which is not aligned.  Is that domain abuse too?

Hm...


Best
Ale
--