Re: [dna] Review of draft-ietf-dna-simple-11

"Laganier, Julien" <julienl@qualcomm.com> Tue, 08 December 2009 17:01 UTC

Return-Path: <julienl@qualcomm.com>
X-Original-To: dna@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dna@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CCE43A68EC for <dna@core3.amsl.com>; Tue, 8 Dec 2009 09:01:24 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -103.604
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.604 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.005, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RFwcHpRL8PlH for <dna@core3.amsl.com>; Tue, 8 Dec 2009 09:01:23 -0800 (PST)
Received: from wolverine02.qualcomm.com (wolverine02.qualcomm.com [199.106.114.251]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 612833A68E9 for <dna@ietf.org>; Tue, 8 Dec 2009 09:01:23 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=qualcomm.com; i=julienl@qualcomm.com; q=dns/txt; s=qcdkim; t=1260291673; x=1291827673; h=from:to:cc:date:subject:thread-topic:thread-index: message-id:references:in-reply-to:accept-language: content-language:x-ms-has-attach:x-ms-tnef-correlator: acceptlanguage:content-type:content-transfer-encoding: mime-version:x-ironport-av; z=From:=20"Laganier,=20Julien"=20<julienl@qualcomm.com> |To:=20Erik=20Nordmark=20<erik.nordmark@sun.com>,=0D=0A =20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20Bernard=20Aboba=0D=0A=09<bernard_ aboba@hotmail.com>|CC:=20"dna@ietf.org"=20<dna@ietf.org> |Date:=20Tue,=208=20Dec=202009=2009:01:10=20-0800 |Subject:=20RE:=20[dna]=20Review=20of=20draft-ietf-dna-si mple-11|Thread-Topic:=20[dna]=20Review=20of=20draft-ietf- dna-simple-11|Thread-Index:=20Acp4Db/F1Eg+ofiCSdqzVG4hiVZ ogAAGPPMA|Message-ID:=20<BF345F63074F8040B58C00A186FCA57F 1C65FB2F3D@NALASEXMB04.na.qualcomm.com>|References:=20<B3 D250DF-D059-48D3-8867-CB1645038382@fugue.com>=0D=0A=09<BL U137-DS7F1790D475CB4996E045E939D0@phx.gbl>=09<4B1D0D9E.30 70203@sun.com>=0D=0A=09<BLU137-DS701722A2CF2EF18C53DD5939 00@phx.gbl>=20<4B1E5A19.5020208@sun.com>|In-Reply-To:=20< 4B1E5A19.5020208@sun.com>|Accept-Language:=20en-US |Content-Language:=20en-US|X-MS-Has-Attach: |X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:|acceptlanguage:=20en-US |Content-Type:=20text/plain=3B=20charset=3D"us-ascii" |Content-Transfer-Encoding:=20quoted-printable |MIME-Version:=201.0|X-IronPort-AV:=20E=3DMcAfee=3Bi=3D"5 400,1158,5826"=3B=20a=3D"29378623"; bh=uf6U4rSxyYeQ8Zu56DLqDW8QfFwpslPano/wATsPKrE=; b=FnD5gqGIWlu2tK8+ZAntNRG/u+4ZO3HUbuEl6nt6tkzDj+QdpEkOsHPz M7DvB6EGO/NQ64YPk2n6p8nfusETc/VM/uKySysjFy6NNP7S0xiqvuw1G 949t5nDT15R/h5PoPd5+OrPeKGk7/PkOaOJWt8g9ywljp9MeD2Z3Yeyhp g=;
X-IronPort-AV: E=McAfee;i="5400,1158,5826"; a="29378623"
Received: from pdmz-ns-mip.qualcomm.com (HELO numenor.qualcomm.com) ([199.106.114.10]) by wolverine02.qualcomm.com with ESMTP; 08 Dec 2009 09:01:13 -0800
Received: from msgtransport01.qualcomm.com (msgtransport01.qualcomm.com [129.46.61.148]) by numenor.qualcomm.com (8.14.2/8.14.2/1.0) with ESMTP id nB8H1CVK018198 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Tue, 8 Dec 2009 09:01:13 -0800
Received: from nasanexhub03.na.qualcomm.com (nasanexhub03.na.qualcomm.com [10.46.93.98]) by msgtransport01.qualcomm.com (8.14.2/8.14.2/1.0) with ESMTP id nB8H1CdL031407 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=NOT); Tue, 8 Dec 2009 09:01:12 -0800
Received: from nalasexhub04.na.qualcomm.com (10.47.130.55) by nasanexhub03.na.qualcomm.com (10.46.93.98) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.2.176.0; Tue, 8 Dec 2009 09:01:12 -0800
Received: from NALASEXMB04.na.qualcomm.com ([10.47.7.118]) by nalasexhub04.na.qualcomm.com ([10.47.130.55]) with mapi; Tue, 8 Dec 2009 09:01:12 -0800
From: "Laganier, Julien" <julienl@qualcomm.com>
To: Erik Nordmark <erik.nordmark@sun.com>, Bernard Aboba <bernard_aboba@hotmail.com>
Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 09:01:10 -0800
Thread-Topic: [dna] Review of draft-ietf-dna-simple-11
Thread-Index: Acp4Db/F1Eg+ofiCSdqzVG4hiVZogAAGPPMA
Message-ID: <BF345F63074F8040B58C00A186FCA57F1C65FB2F3D@NALASEXMB04.na.qualcomm.com>
References: <B3D250DF-D059-48D3-8867-CB1645038382@fugue.com> <BLU137-DS7F1790D475CB4996E045E939D0@phx.gbl> <4B1D0D9E.3070203@sun.com> <BLU137-DS701722A2CF2EF18C53DD593900@phx.gbl> <4B1E5A19.5020208@sun.com>
In-Reply-To: <4B1E5A19.5020208@sun.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
Cc: "dna@ietf.org" <dna@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [dna] Review of draft-ietf-dna-simple-11
X-BeenThere: dna@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: DNA working group mailing list <dna.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dna>, <mailto:dna-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/dna>
List-Post: <mailto:dna@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dna-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dna>, <mailto:dna-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Dec 2009 17:01:24 -0000

Erik Nordmark wrote:
> 
> Bernard Aboba wrote:
> > Erik said:
> >
> > "Perhaps the reference to "STALE" is not clear above?
> > STALE refers to a state in RFC 4861 which implies that the host would
> > trigger NUD sooner rather than later. If it isn't set to STALE then
> > it might take up to 30 seconds more to detect that a router has gone
> > dead. Thus a neighbor cache entry of STALE doesn't have anything to 
> > do with a routing table entry (unless the implementation is broken.)"
> >
> > Since simple DNA involves sending out NS and RS packets, if the host
> > has a valid address on the network corresponding to the STALE entry,
> > it will effectively complete NUD as part of DNA.  Also, by sending
> > out the RS it will discover whether the router whose entry has
> > been marked STALE is actually there or not.
> >
> > Given this, why would a host take 30 seconds to detect that a router
> > has gone dead?  Simple DNA should have completed (with a new default
> > router entry) long before that.
> 
> I was merely responding to Ted's concern, which is unrelated to the use
> of STALE state.
> You are asking a different question about the utility of STALE.
> 
> I have no go over the whole document more carefully, but AFAICT when
> the host has moved to a new link it needs to make sure old neighbor cache
> entries don't get in the way. That isn't specified in section 4.8.
> Marking the NCEs as STALE definitely help with that for the same that
> the same link-local addresses are in use on the old and new links.

IIRC marking old NCEs as STALE takes care of a case where the routers on the old and new link have the same link-local address. By marking the old NCE as STALE, one make sure that the new NCE in REACHABLE state will be preferred over the old one (the new NCE is in REACHABLE state as a result of receiving a solicited RA, or completing NUD with the router.) 

--julien