Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs

"John Levine" <johnl@taugh.com> Fri, 26 April 2013 23:14 UTC

Return-Path: <johnl@iecc.com>
X-Original-To: dnsext@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dnsext@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C63F21F9D15 for <dnsext@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 26 Apr 2013 16:14:54 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -110.874
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-110.874 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.325, BAYES_00=-2.599, HABEAS_ACCREDITED_SOI=-4.3, RCVD_IN_BSP_TRUSTED=-4.3, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qf+pZYKzUV6P for <dnsext@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 26 Apr 2013 16:14:53 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from leila.iecc.com (leila6.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:4c:6569:6c61]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60DC221F9D0D for <dnsext@ietf.org>; Fri, 26 Apr 2013 16:14:53 -0700 (PDT)
Received: (qmail 84239 invoked from network); 26 Apr 2013 23:14:52 -0000
Received: from leila.iecc.com (64.57.183.34) by mail1.iecc.com with QMQP; 26 Apr 2013 23:14:52 -0000
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=517b0a6c.xn--i8sz2z.k1304; i=johnl@user.iecc.com; bh=BDjkOMNkY9GF95J6Ii8Jjxkk8rSh8mehA8jgEgq0U5g=; b=FaCP0Df8D5admtIfViA6NGHzYmhb9DnX6K1wk6GLd3hqA6b/yUAd3qgsUrmYqNW7PxeGWZ94yrHmyblEQZJ6WBKIN7zWo3+CIEu28Luqf7fFVfLtcFQr3sy2+yexEzxkfacqS/Xz0VNNkoJL1WoC/ggCbf09mudhHRQ9mUdmDuY=
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=taugh.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=517b0a6c.xn--i8sz2z.k1304; olt=johnl@user.iecc.com; bh=BDjkOMNkY9GF95J6Ii8Jjxkk8rSh8mehA8jgEgq0U5g=; b=01NNbZlr7FJXffKLxpmRzAylRcJ8ChJCiVZUwg5/pCEIBnOS8/BKRlQPrNo3VSkjhFSzKQcfEN2WaMYMoc0dIDSXvZ8IRiqRPPEA/+Pd0wxj+R1uHcSEhreorm3o9p2fTpt+XvQISoIi8bXFe1aMXheWt1JkFHVrjzEiTyIH7LU=
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 23:14:30 -0000
Message-ID: <20130426231430.75437.qmail@joyce.lan>
From: John Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
To: dnsext@ietf.org
In-Reply-To: <20130426121424.GA349@mx1.yitter.info>
Organization:
X-Headerized: yes
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs
X-BeenThere: dnsext@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: DNS Extensions working group discussion list <dnsext.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dnsext>, <mailto:dnsext-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/dnsext>
List-Post: <mailto:dnsext@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dnsext-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsext>, <mailto:dnsext-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 23:14:54 -0000

>On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 06:41:31PM -0700, Doug Barton wrote:
>
>> 1. Insert the ability into the interface to add freeform stuff
>> 2. Run the equivalent of named-checkzone prior to committing the change
>> 3. Profit!
>
>That's preposterously naive.  Step 2.1 is "Find that customer who has
>no theory of the mystifying DNS arcana screwed it up, so you can't
>publish, and now you have to contact a human.  Stop.  Invoke expensive
>off-page customer service process."  In some significant number of
>cases, we never get to step 3.  In the DNS business, the margins are
>small.  

You also forgot step 1.9, in which the software faeries magically
update named-checkzone for every new RRTYPE, even though the times
when new RRTYPEs are defined bear no relation to any sort of software
update or release schedule, and people who want to experiment with new
RRTYPEs are unlikely also to have the skills or inclination to patch
the BIND parser.

R's,
John

PS: That's why my hack, using an idea from Vixie, automatically
configures new RRTYPEs as they're published, with no software changes
or updates needed.  Again, I don't claim that's the only way to do it,
but I do strongly believe that a useful configurable provisioning or
DNS system can't require per-RR software changes.