Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf-03.txt
P Vix <paul@redbarn.org> Tue, 20 March 2018 18:32 UTC
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To: dnsop@ietf.org, "John R. Levine" <johnl@iecc.com>, Applications and Real-Time Area Discussion <art@ietf.org>
From: P Vix <paul@redbarn.org>
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Subject: Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf-03.txt
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Harmonization for the sake of harmonization is bad, and very little Internet System technology gets it. Just do new stuff better. On March 20, 2018 6:11:08 PM UTC, "John R. Levine" <johnl@iecc.com> wrote: >After some back and forth with Dave, I realized I missed what seems to >be >to be a large change: this draft redefines the naming rules for SRV and > >URI. > >The current rule is that SRV is _service._protocol where the protocol >is >from a short list including _tcp and _udp and the service is from the >IANA >Service Name and Transport Protocol Port Number Registry most recently >defined by RFC 6335. This draft proposes that the service names now >come >from a newly defined second-level name registry in the draft. The URI >record uses the same namespace, but nobody believes it's widely used so > >it's less of an issue. > >This seems to be a large change for very little benefit, and >unlikely to be backward compatible unless we can identify every service > >name now in use with SRV which seems unlikely. > >R's, >John > > >> G'day. This concerns an activity in dnsop, but the wg chair has quite > >> reasonably suggested running a significant, proposed change past apps >folk, >> since the work affects a number of existing and future apps efforts. > (In >> fact, the effort was first triggered by the DKIM work, more than 12 >years >> ago...) >> >> The domain of discourse is _underscore domain names, used for >defining a >> special place to use some DNS resource records, such as TXT and SRV. >> >> There are quite a few, existing documents that define such use, all >without >> the benefit of a common registry. Hence the danger of name >collision. The >> attrleaf effort is seeking to define a registry for holding existing >> _underscore names and defining new ones. >> >> Besides defining the registry, the task requires updating existing >> specifications to use it. The attrleaf draft has attempted to >perform both >> tasks in a single document, but this has made for a confused and >confusing >> document. (There's a larger lesson here, in spec writing...) >> >> More recent discussions (well, actually, last August) in dnsop, >pointed >> toward splitting registry definition from existing document updating, >and the >> note below points to a new draft that does the first. The note also >charts >> out the plan for the updating document. >> >> Comments? >> >> d/ >> >> -------- Forwarded Message -------- >> Subject: [DNSOP] Fwd: New Version Notification for >> draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf-03.txt >> Date: Mon, 19 Mar 2018 17:35:29 -0700 >> From: Dave Crocker <dhc2@dcrocker.net> >> Reply-To: dcrocker@bbiw.net >> Organization: Brandenburg InternetWorking >> To: dnsop <dnsop@ietf.org> >> >> Folks, >> >> I'll limit what should be an extensive and elaborate apology to just >this: >> I'm sorry for the year of inactivity. >> >> The -03 version should provide some useful substance of progress. >> >> I've gone over last summer's comments and the -03 version should >reflect what >> the wg agreed to. Basically, it has been significantly streamlined, >> essentially to reflect a clean-sheet model of the world. That is, it >doesn't >> deal with the ugliness that SRV, et al, created. It merely >establishes the >> two registries we need, long term, and populates them. This document >should >> have continuing utility. >> >> -03 defines two registries, 'global' and 'second-level'. I'm >suspicious of >> how short the global one is, though it does make sense. >> >> As noted in the document, absent major concerns with the substance of >the >> document, please send me or the list s/old/new/ types of change >suggestions, >> and if the change is for a reference, I'd love the suggestion to be >> <reference> xml... >> >> >> A second document will attempt to fix up the uglinesses in some >existing >> documents, to get them to align with a world that has these >registries. It >> should be viewed as a transitional document, though we all know how >glacial >> 'transitions' are in the Internet... >> >> Deciding how to pursue that reasonably has been the effort. The >changes this >> 'fixes' document defines will be to documentation, but not to >existing >> operation. Existing uses in the field will be preserved. >> >> >> Here's the approach I'm taking: >> >> >> 1. Simple underscore usage >> >> For many/most specifications that use underscore naming, the text >merely >> says to use it. They are straightforward. >> >> These specifications need to be listed in this document, >explicitly, so >> that later updates to them will know to deal with the revisions >called for by >> this document. >> >> But this document doesn't really need s/old/new kinds of precise >detail >> for them. Rather than provide precise language for changing each of >these, I >> propose to provide some generic text, and generic IANA >Considerations. This >> will permit this Fixes document to be cited as Updating those RFCs. >> >> >> 2. SRV and URI >> >> These need more detailed text, very much in the s/old/new style. >> >> The current text in them does a use-by-reference of existing tables > >> defined for other purposes. The Update text will, instead, specify a > >> requirement for adding entries in the Global or Common Second-Level >> registries. >> >> >> d/ >> >> >> -------- Forwarded Message -------- >> >> Name: draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf >> Revision: 03 >> Title: DNS Scoped Data Through '_Underscore' Naming of Attribute >> Leaves >> Document date: 2018-03-19 >> Group: dnsop >> Pages: 14 >> URL: >https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf-03.txt >> Status: >https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf/ >> Htmlized: >https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf-03 >> Htmlized: >https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf >> Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf-03 >> >> > >Regards, >John Levine, johnl@iecc.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for >Dummies", >Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. >https://jl.ly > >_______________________________________________ >DNSOP mailing list >DNSOP@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop -- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
- [DNSOP] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-i… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… tjw ietf
- Re: [DNSOP] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-ie… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-ie… P Vix
- Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-ie… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] New Version Notification for draft-ie… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… John C Klensin
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] redefining SRV, New Version Not… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] redefining SRV, New Version Not… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Alexey Melnikov
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] redefining SRV, New Version Not… Ray Bellis
- [DNSOP] Attrleaf _second-Level modifications (was… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] Attrleaf _second-Level modifications Ray Bellis
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… John Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] New Version Notification for dr… John R Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Attrleaf _second-Level modifica… John Levine
- [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrleaf-… John C Klensin
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… John C Klensin
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… John C Klensin
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… John C Klensin
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… John C Klensin
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Kurt Andersen (b)
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… John C Klensin
- [DNSOP] _openpgpkey & _smimecert (was: Re: [art] … Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Paul Vixie
- [DNSOP] namespace and substring reservations (was… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Ray Bellis
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Dave Crocker
- [DNSOP] Additional uses of underscore labels (was… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [DNSOP] Additional uses of underscore labels Dave Crocker
- [DNSOP] End-to-end _underscore arguments (was: Re… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… Warren Kumari
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… Warren Kumari
- Re: [DNSOP] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop-attrl… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… John C Klensin
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Adam Roach
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Dave Crocker
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… John R. Levine
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… Paul Vixie
- Re: [DNSOP] [art] Another look - draft-ietf-dnsop… John R. Levine