Re: [DNSOP] [dns-operations] dnsop-any-notimp violates the DNS standards

Tony Finch <dot@dotat.at> Mon, 09 March 2015 16:09 UTC

Return-Path: <fanf2@hermes.cam.ac.uk>
X-Original-To: dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB3ED1A8722 for <dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 9 Mar 2015 09:09:49 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.211
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.211 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8W8QlqeyV2X0 for <dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 9 Mar 2015 09:09:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ppsw-50.csi.cam.ac.uk (ppsw-50.csi.cam.ac.uk [131.111.8.150]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 50CB61A8967 for <dnsop@ietf.org>; Mon, 9 Mar 2015 09:09:47 -0700 (PDT)
X-Cam-AntiVirus: no malware found
X-Cam-ScannerInfo: http://www.cam.ac.uk/cs/email/scanner/
Received: from hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk ([131.111.8.51]:53586) by ppsw-50.csi.cam.ac.uk (smtp.hermes.cam.ac.uk [131.111.8.158]:25) with esmtpa (EXTERNAL:fanf2) id 1YV0FU-0008V1-rd (Exim 4.82_3-c0e5623) (return-path <fanf2@hermes.cam.ac.uk>); Mon, 09 Mar 2015 16:09:44 +0000
Received: from fanf2 by hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk (hermes.cam.ac.uk) with local id 1YV0FU-00045H-Ir (Exim 4.72) (return-path <fanf2@hermes.cam.ac.uk>); Mon, 09 Mar 2015 16:09:44 +0000
Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2015 16:09:44 +0000
From: Tony Finch <dot@dotat.at>
X-X-Sender: fanf2@hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk
To: bert hubert <bert.hubert@netherlabs.nl>
In-Reply-To: <20150309151812.GA14897@xs.powerdns.com>
Message-ID: <alpine.LSU.2.00.1503091606450.10193@hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk>
References: <20150309110803.4516.qmail@cr.yp.to> <20150309151812.GA14897@xs.powerdns.com>
User-Agent: Alpine 2.00 (LSU 1167 2008-08-23)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset="US-ASCII"
Sender: Tony Finch <fanf2@hermes.cam.ac.uk>
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dnsop/FfnAkZ_m70iC5Q1H8v0nk99bQe8>
Cc: dnsop@ietf.org, dns-operations@dns-oarc.net
Subject: Re: [DNSOP] [dns-operations] dnsop-any-notimp violates the DNS standards
X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list <dnsop.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dnsop>, <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/dnsop/>
List-Post: <mailto:dnsop@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop>, <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2015 16:09:50 -0000

bert hubert <bert.hubert@netherlabs.nl> wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 09, 2015 at 11:08:03AM -0000, D. J. Bernstein wrote:
> > My "qmail" software is very widely deployed (on roughly 1 million SMTP
> > server IP addresses) and, by default, relies upon ANY queries in a way
> > that is guaranteed to work by the mandatory DNS standards.
>
> The way I read RFC 1034 4.3.2, this is not true. In step 4 we match whatever
> we find in the cache, put it in the packet, and move on to step 6.
>
> This means the algorithm might terminate returning only an A record or only
> an AAAA record.  Or a TXT record for that matter.
>
> This reading of 4.3.2 makes 'ANY' queries to resolvers fragile. It might not
> return what you need.

Dan is aware of that, but this particular oddity isn't a problem for
qmail. Later in his message he wrote:

> > Of course, there's no guarantee of which RR types for a node are
> > available at a cache, but a client is guaranteed to be able to detect
> > CNAME records from responses to query type ANY (as qmail does), since
> > a CNAME type prohibits all regular RR types.

Tony.
-- 
f.anthony.n.finch  <dot@dotat.at>  http://dotat.at/
Fair Isle: Southeast veering west, severe gale 9 to violent storm 11. Very
rough or high, becoming very high for a time. Rain then showers. Moderate or
poor, becoming good.