Re: [DNSOP] [Ext] Starting a -bis document for RFC 8109: Initializing a DNS Resolver with Priming Queries

Paul Hoffman <paul.hoffman@icann.org> Thu, 06 August 2020 23:20 UTC

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From: Paul Hoffman <paul.hoffman@icann.org>
To: George Michaelson <ggm@algebras.org>
CC: dnsop WG <dnsop@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [DNSOP] [Ext] Starting a -bis document for RFC 8109: Initializing a DNS Resolver with Priming Queries
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Date: Thu, 6 Aug 2020 23:20:51 +0000
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Subject: Re: [DNSOP] [Ext] Starting a -bis document for RFC 8109: Initializing a DNS Resolver with Priming Queries
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On Aug 6, 2020, at 3:32 PM, George Michaelson <ggm@algebras.org> wrote:
> 
> If I (insanely) ran a totally manual, out of band process to
> periodically canvas the space and injected the knowns into the model
> of "root" for my resolver, would I be able to say I am primed?

Not by the standard, no. RFC 8109 was passed by this WG as a standard.

> I am trying to get to the point that the "how" part is only exemplary,
> explanatory. The requirement is that you have the information, now how
> you get it or how it comes into your resolver.

That is not true for this standard. This standard gives the way to be primed following what has already been standardized before now. You can get the NS RRset for the root zone into your resolver in other ways, and the resolver would work fine, but that is not priming as standardized here.

If you're asking the trivial question of whether you could continue to operate without following the standard, the trivial answer is of course "yes".

> The distinction between shipped states of the root.hints and the
> actual live mappings of the domain labels inherent in it, to addresses
> (if you like) I can bypass the hints file ,and use SQL to update my
> root mapping.
> 
> I think the intent of "priming" is that you then populate the
> information from 'inside' DNS. But, again, its only advisory, its not
> standards enforced is it?

You could ask to remove that designation in this -bis document if you want. I, for one, would disagree with such a request.

> I can populate my continuing knowledge of
> the state of the DNS at the root, or anywhere else, in any mechanism I
> like.

Yep, and nothing in the current standard or this updating document says that you can't. They say that the standard for priming is done this way. 

> I could periodically FTP the zone files from places, and populate my
> resolver cache state from these. I could basically "never" forward DNS
> queries high in the tree, if I felt like making my server do that.
> 
> Am I "not primed" if I do this?

Not by the standard, no. You still would have a running system. If you want to call it "primed" (or "Fred"), that's up to you.

--Paul Hoffman