Re: [DNSOP] NXDOMAINs as in RFC 1034

Shumon Huque <shuque@gmail.com> Tue, 29 May 2018 10:18 UTC

Return-Path: <shuque@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC959126FDC for <dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 29 May 2018 03:18:44 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.998
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pV9JCXyXLFc4 for <dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 29 May 2018 03:18:42 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-yb0-x22f.google.com (mail-yb0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4002:c09::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BA53C12E88D for <dnsop@ietf.org>; Tue, 29 May 2018 03:18:42 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-yb0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id m137-v6so2556590ybm.6 for <dnsop@ietf.org>; Tue, 29 May 2018 03:18:42 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=9j2KkGDh1eLu1Nw7L6lH//3zZBiyEJ/eXOFSQsXImos=; b=ob25p5ZK1gIMB5M0S4tlfVxYHAt75J3rflu5eM/AHClsWPY37J1lWVj0m2yw4rJi/u Q/RspEwi+J38to2gJxLoupImnzQS7a1t3l10WoNgizlLSgyJlVPDZrhu0+Wa7Oxr8fcs Hr2T1vMlzYb+mJuhYO1lLEOgkPq+taCPdDqbX0Hv7xW1cvMUozodHKJbldLkrLI0IVPF t0BHL09Rw3mBUZ5m9krMA+LqxGymagrp5AOwh7jjL1MfdG6JVfM7oUpwBveFcFsjZVlu 7LvBVRDYZkuhfQ/sOXwANTjjdwoYl79At/lZstJ29J6JIn/FGXx+kQLz6BemHR0+c7Xk mKTQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=9j2KkGDh1eLu1Nw7L6lH//3zZBiyEJ/eXOFSQsXImos=; b=Jif5taoXvwD9I8F+vZVHCbdnXXIyog7YC71UU+LkP9lmOxj0dB0BaYkGafEtsJ+Ijx gNgdzvu3fcAC3OibX/ztRGPUsk0VN6iN+lU73v4aDrUZLPfcLeFhnX1qLfabOD9oIZad bb5H2HIYJfggIBQq6GgmVvt4ew5WrHfd/qa/ZTN30fWOurnnC9IJhffU1NtynRDKkf6C UqhHdyHYOusqw8rOtuwVt5CdPzrjKbWiZPKYd0xgQtpy6lhd7DFgTNMFOHSitvZAIWFv 1CFf0CLQV81aZ5QY8Bbqf7mo6VKJUfSYTcWwslgW2687ZldQunUQOvS8hU4MhD+v6JW/ LXiw==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALKqPwekYYggoSm2zdOVnAyvJK6YHKqEVxy5zWyZoCB1hssOx4wHq/DJ eU4nw9A6Dw/GjaubJkHLynPQPJ9Xb4gKzP/dbRk=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ADUXVKIe5ICkMlXJ6PQ7f4RYe2vMVpGDafeYg42LM/ulUmE0ayfDs7T3oYXc0/4gyc3oqsQuQ6O+m+2w0g1Nf+0Dajo=
X-Received: by 2002:a25:ae0a:: with SMTP id a10-v6mr3032984ybj.62.1527589121977; Tue, 29 May 2018 03:18:41 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <20180528181236.GB26171@jurassic> <CAHPuVdX8D38XfB98gRuBYr+Vn9v_j_5rxY12R+AF0Cyz04Ggag@mail.gmail.com> <20180529054503.GA8413@jurassic>
In-Reply-To: <20180529054503.GA8413@jurassic>
From: Shumon Huque <shuque@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 29 May 2018 06:19:43 -0400
Message-ID: <CAHPuVdWmAraeQT7nQ71vTZJBAESO5+dUROuacbEA_S7kQfvayA@mail.gmail.com>
To: muks@mukund.org
Cc: "dnsop@ietf.org WG" <dnsop@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000fa726f056d558e7a"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dnsop/m7guOXm4nflYTV5cbWkFseLARAw>
Subject: Re: [DNSOP] NXDOMAINs as in RFC 1034
X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list <dnsop.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dnsop>, <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dnsop/>
List-Post: <mailto:dnsop@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop>, <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 May 2018 10:18:45 -0000

On Tue, May 29, 2018 at 1:45 AM Mukund Sivaraman <muks@mukund.org> wrote:

>
> RFC 1034 states in 3.1 "The domain system makes no distinctions between
> the uses of the interior nodes and leaves, and this memo uses the term
> "node" to refer to both."
>

Right.


> Then, it states in 3.6 "A domain name identifies a node.  Each node has
> a set of resource information, which may be empty."
>

Ah, great. I couldn't remember whether 1034 described this explicitly.
Thanks
for quoting the relevant sentences. My point was that 1034 did not use the
term "Empty Non Terminal", although as you point out here, it clearly
describes
the concept (an interior node with no resource information, and that this
node
exists).


> I agree clarification is good, and so RFC 8020++.. however note the
> point Vixie makes - NXDOMAINs for ENTs have never been correct in the
> DNS. RFC 8020 clarifies it, but the implementations which return
> NXDOMAINs are broken against RFC 1034 onwards.
>

Yes, agreed completely.

Shumon.