Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sctl-service-registration-02.txt
Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> Thu, 19 July 2018 02:07 UTC
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From: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>
Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2018 22:06:48 -0400
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To: Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com>
Cc: dnssd <dnssd@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sctl-service-registration-02.txt
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Okay, I've pushed fixes for the last couple of issues you guys brought up. I used _dnssd-srp._tcp instead of _dns-update._udp, but that's up for debate. https://github.com/StuartCheshire/draft-sctl-service-registration/commit/ce15160933b458a2da2346b6181ad89ed0ff1e11 On Wed, Jul 18, 2018 at 9:36 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote: > Yes, that’s the correct behavior. > > On Wed, Jul 18, 2018 at 9:30 PM Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> wrote: > >> Yeah, that needs to be more explicit. >> >> If you try to do a delete, does the server send REFUSED? >> >> Thanks, >> Tom >> >> On Jul 18, 2018, at 8:27 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote: >> >> You can't delete anything from a service name. Maybe we need to say >> that more explicitly. Right now the protocol doesn't allow a service to >> delete itself; only to add itself. The assumption is that the service >> will not know in advance that it is leaving the network, so service entries >> get garbage collected, rather than being explicitly deleted. Compare to >> DHCPRELEASE in the DHCP protocol, which is pretty useless. >> >> On Wed, Jul 18, 2018 at 7:40 PM, Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> wrote: >> >>> You might not need a new KEY record for the PTR but you may need to >>> follow the instance of the PTR to a KEY record to make sure you have >>> permission to delete the PTR record. >>> >>> Tom >>> >>> >>> On Jul 18, 2018, at 7:37 PM, Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> wrote: >>> >>> Tim and I were talking and we were wondering if one client could delete >>> the PTR record for a service instance that another client created? Seems >>> like it’s not protected and could be a denial of service attack? So you >>> might need a KEY record the PTR record. >>> >>> Tom >>> >>> On Jul 18, 2018, at 1:08 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote: >>> >>> Hm, you're right, that's never stated explicitly. >>> >>> On Wed, Jul 18, 2018 at 12:48 PM, Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I don’t see anywhere in the document where the anycast update method >>>> relies on UDP. >>>> >>>> Tom >>>> >>>> >>>> On Jul 18, 2018, at 12:27 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> Of course, you still have a very good point in that the anycast update >>>> method relies on UDP, so sending the key multiple times isn't desirable. >>>> But I also don't see a way around this. We could have the server >>>> replicate the key, I guess. >>>> >>>> On Wed, Jul 18, 2018 at 12:25 PM, Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Just saw this in Section 2: "By requiring the use of TCP, the >>>>> possibility of off-network spoofing is eliminated”. So requiring TCP is >>>>> already handled. >>>>> >>>>> Searching for _dns-update._udp.<domain> still seems odd but that’s >>>>> been going on for a while a presume. >>>>> >>>>> Tom >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Jul 18, 2018, at 12:15 PM, Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Looking in the IANA registry, dns-update isn’t assigned for TCP. So >>>>> either you search for _dns-update._udp.<domain> and use TCP or you >>>>> register _tcp. >>>>> >>>>> And while you could use an EDNS(0) OPT RR to set the maximum UDP >>>>> packet size larger than 512, you probably wouldn’t want to set it larger >>>>> than the MTU and 1480 isn’t big enough for 3 KEYs plus other records. >>>>> >>>>> Tom >>>>> >>>>> On Jul 18, 2018, at 12:05 PM, Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> If you are adding more KEY records, you will certainly exceed the UDP >>>>> update size of 512 bytes. The draft doesn’t mention transport but maybe >>>>> this should be restricted to TCP. >>>>> The draft does mention searching for the update server using >>>>> _dns-update._udp.<domain>. But then it won’t be able to use UDP for >>>>> updates. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> Tom >>>>> >>>>> On Jul 17, 2018, at 4:12 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Tim pointed out that we need to protect the Service Instance Name as >>>>> well as the Host Description with a KEY record, because FCFS naming has to >>>>> protect both the service description and the host description. Here are >>>>> the changes: >>>>> >>>>> https://github.com/StuartCheshire/draft-sctl- >>>>> service-registration/compare/ae53618d8231733701ccdda4d33669 >>>>> 2a529c9f6b...5c85181881b84ed1132d544e157df8da85874597 >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 6:42 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> The question of whether we update RFC6763 is basically "is there text >>>>>> that is in RFC6763 that is no longer correct because of this document." I >>>>>> think the answer is no. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 6:41 PM, Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Ok, just checking. So given that 6763 semi-defines service >>>>>>> registration protocol as DNS Dynamic Update, should this document claim it >>>>>>> updates 6763? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>> Tom >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Jul 16, 2018, at 6:01 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The title of RFC 6763 is DNS-Based Service Discovery. So I tried >>>>>>> to harmonize the document toward that—did I miss something? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 5:59 PM, Tom Pusateri <pusateri@bangj.com> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> How is DNS-Based Service Discovery different from DNS Service >>>>>>>> Discovery? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Is this meant to distinguish from RFC 6763? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>> Tom >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Jul 16, 2018, at 5:46 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> BTW, the current version of the document on github now includes >>>>>>>> fixes for all the points that have been raised other than the ones I said I >>>>>>>> wasn't going to fix: https://github.com/StuartCheshire/draft-sctl- >>>>>>>> service-registration >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 5:29 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 5:27 PM, Toke Høiland-Jørgensen < >>>>>>>>> toke@toke.dk> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> writes: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Why can't it be just a Host Description? Might be useful for a >>>>>>>>>> device >>>>>>>>>> that just wants to register its name but doesn't (currently, or >>>>>>>>>> ever) >>>>>>>>>> advertise any services... >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Good question. What does the working group think? :) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> dnssd mailing list >>>>>>>> dnssd@ietf.org >>>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnssd >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> dnssd mailing list >>>>>>> dnssd@ietf.org >>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnssd >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> dnssd mailing list >>>>> dnssd@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnssd >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> dnssd mailing list >>>>> dnssd@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnssd >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> dnssd mailing list >>>>> dnssd@ietf.org >>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnssd >>>>> <https://www.ietf..org/mailman/listinfo/dnssd> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> dnssd mailing list >>>> dnssd@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnssd >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> dnssd mailing list >>> dnssd@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnssd >>> >>> >>> >>
- [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-s… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Tim Wattenberg
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tim Wattenberg
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Toke Høiland-Jørgensen
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] Fwd: New Version Notification for dra… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tim Wattenberg
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tim Wattenberg
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tom Pusateri
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnssd] New Version Notification for draft-sc… Tim Wicinski