[Doh] ..I don't get it (the hate)

George Michaelson <ggm@algebras.org> Tue, 26 March 2019 11:15 UTC

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From: George Michaelson <ggm@algebras.org>
Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 12:15:36 +0100
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To: DoH WG <doh@ietf.org>
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Subject: [Doh] ..I don't get it (the hate)
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I have (fictionally) invented two new technologies. Lets call  them
"VPN" and "IP in IP"

at this point, every ISP in the IETF microphone queue wants to stand
up and say this has severe operational issues for them in running a
carriage service and "stop this nonsense"

the "DOH will cause me operational problems" thing, I simply don't understand.

 * I can write web pages with embedded IP addresses any time. I can
remove the DNS from my web calls

 * Nobody really knows what is flowing over the end-to-end any more,
given QUIC and like protocols.

This standard is a mechanism to define how to embed state in HTTP,
which means DNS traffic doesn't happen. But, DNS does or doesn't
happen *come what may* -we are arguing about a *standard* way to
specify how "not to do DNS" visibly.

I am not saying I'm in love with DOH (I ask myself what cache
poisoning risks there are in held state in the browser, and how far
outside a sandbox fetched data can extend) but, the .. "it is evil and
must die" side, I just don't understand.

The "DOH breaks privacy" and "centralization must be confronted"
questions, thats different. But, I am trying to think like a customer,
sending packets, and what I feel about the packets, and who gets to
say what is in them and what they are for.

This is (surely) between me, the browser vendor, and the website? Why
does the ISP have any say in this?

Not standardising this, is not going to stop people thinking about
ways to construct web site state which pass information in JSON form,
which informs which getURL() calls are made, and which demand
gethostbyname() and which do not invoe gethostbyname()