Re: [Dots] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00.txt

"Jon Shallow" <supjps-ietf@jpshallow.com> Tue, 23 July 2019 09:29 UTC

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From: "Jon Shallow" <supjps-ietf@jpshallow.com>
To: "'Konda, Tirumaleswar Reddy'" <TirumaleswarReddy_Konda@mcafee.com>, "'Konda, Tirumaleswar Reddy'" <TirumaleswarReddy_Konda@mcafee.com>, <dots@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Dots] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00.txt
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Hi Kaname,

 

“When an attack occur, the DDoS detection system will notice that the customer is under attack, then the pre-mitigation DOTS telemetry(= attack details) can be signaled from the DOTS server to the (associated) DOTS client”

 

How is the DOTS telemetry information signalled/pushed from the DOTS server to the DOTS client?

Can it be assumed that a mitigation request is already active from the DOTS client and the telemetry update is piggybacked on a mitigation observe response?

Is it down to the client doing a periodic poll of a (potentially new) resource?

 

[The call home concept could cover this, but the client and server roles need to be clearly defined with possibly a client and server being resident in each peer]

 

Regards

 

Jon

 

From: Dots [mailto: dots-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Konda, Tirumaleswar Reddy
Sent: 23 July 2019 08:04
To: kaname nishizuka; tirumal reddy; dots@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Dots] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00.txt

 

Thanks for the clarification. I don’t think any of the DOTS use cases documents discuss this deployment. DOTS signal channel looks more suitable for these Pre-mitigation DOTS Telemetry Attributes than the DOTS data channel. 

 

Cheers,

-Tiru

 

From: kaname nishizuka <kaname@nttv6.jp>; 
Sent: Monday, July 22, 2019 8:26 PM
To: Konda, Tirumaleswar Reddy <TirumaleswarReddy_Konda@McAfee.com>;; tirumal reddy <kondtir@gmail.com>;; dots@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Dots] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00.txt

 


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  _____  

Hi Tiru,

Let me explain it.
There is a service by several transit providers such as detection capabilities to notify clients of potential attacks.
It is assumed that they have a DDoS mitigation system and a DDoS detection system (for example, a flow collector) separately.
It is a realistic deployment that the DOTS server is integrated with the flow collector.

When an attack occur, the DDoS detection system will notice that the customer is under attack, then the pre-mitigation DOTS telemetry(= attack details) can be signaled from the DOTS server to the (associated) DOTS client.

Here is one of the traffic anomaly detection notification example (threshold basis) quoted from some actual service.
Organization:       XXX
Attack ID:          13227
Start Time:         2019/06/05 22:52:30 JST+0900
Level:              1
Traffic Amount:     4.02k pps
Threshold:          4.00k pps
Direction:          incoming
Victim IP Address:  x.x.x.x/32
Attack Type:        TCP SYN

It says like "it seems you're under attack, what will you do? (We can offer some protection)"

regards,
Kaname

On 2019/07/22 23:11, Konda, Tirumaleswar Reddy wrote:

Thanks Kaname for the support. I did not get the comment. what type of pre-mitigation DOTS telemetry attributes can be signaled from the DOTS server to the DOTS client ?

And How will the DOTS server know the pre-mitigation DOTS telemetry attributes relevant or associated with a DOTS client ? 

 

Cheers,

-Tiru

 

From: Dots  <mailto:dots-bounces@ietf.org> <dots-bounces@ietf.org>; On Behalf Of kaname nishizuka
Sent: Monday, July 22, 2019 6:44 PM
To: tirumal reddy  <mailto:kondtir@gmail.com> <kondtir@gmail.com>;; dots@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Dots] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00.txt

 


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  _____  


I support this draft.

I'd like to mention about the telemetry attributes from a DOTS server to a DOTS client.
Currently, several transit ISPs are providing DDoS detection and protection services.
In such a service, they send a DDoS detection notification via e-mail when they noticed that their customer is under attack.
The mail includes the telemetry information such as 4.1.5. Attack Details.
This info can be used for further decision of protection strategy by the customer's security operators.
I think it should be covered by the DOTS telemetry specification.

One suggestion to the draft:
Pre-mitigation DOTS Telemetry Attributes can also be signaled from the DOTS server to the DOTS client.

thanks,
Kaname




On 2019/07/05 22:20, tirumal reddy wrote:

Hi all,

 

https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00 aims to enrich DOTS protocols with various telemetry attributes allowing optimal DDoS attack mitigation. This document specifies the normal traffic baseline and attack traffic telemetry attributes a DOTS client can convey to its DOTS server in the mitigation request, the mitigation status telemetry attributes a DOTS server can communicate to a DOTS client, and the mitigation efficacy telemetry attributes a DOTS client can communicate to a DOTS server.  The telemetry attributes can assist the mitigator to choose the DDoS mitigation techniques and perform optimal DDoS attack mitigation.

Comments, suggestions, and questions are more than welcome.


Cheers,

-Tiru

 

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: <internet-drafts@ietf.org>;
Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2019 at 18:44
Subject: New Version Notification for draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00.txt
To: Tirumaleswar Reddy <kondtir@gmail.com>;, Ehud Doron <ehudd@radware.com>;, Mohamed Boucadair <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>;




A new version of I-D, draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00.txt
has been successfully submitted by Tirumaleswar Reddy and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name:           draft-reddy-dots-telemetry
Revision:       00
Title:          Distributed Denial-of-Service Open Threat Signaling (DOTS) Telemetry
Document date:  2019-07-05
Group:          Individual Submission
Pages:          13
URL:            https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00.txt
Status:         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-reddy-dots-telemetry/
Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-reddy-dots-telemetry-00
Htmlized:       https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-reddy-dots-telemetry


Abstract:
   This document aims to enrich DOTS signal channel protocol with
   various telemetry attributes allowing optimal DDoS attack mitigation.
   This document specifies the normal traffic baseline and attack
   traffic telemetry attributes a DOTS client can convey to its DOTS
   server in the mitigation request, the mitigation status telemetry
   attributes a DOTS server can communicate to a DOTS client, and the
   mitigation efficacy telemetry attributes a DOTS client can
   communicate to a DOTS server.  The telemetry attributes can assist
   the mitigator to choose the DDoS mitigation techniques and perform
   optimal DDoS attack mitigation.




Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

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