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Re: [dsfjdssdfsd] specifying an RNG

Michael Hammer <michael.hammer@yaanatech.com> Fri, 15 November 2013 18:41 UTC

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From: Michael Hammer <michael.hammer@yaanatech.com>
To: "yaronf.ietf@gmail.com" <yaronf.ietf@gmail.com>, "jsalowey@cisco.com" <jsalowey@cisco.com>
Thread-Topic: [dsfjdssdfsd] specifying an RNG
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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2013 18:40:59 +0000
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Subject: Re: [dsfjdssdfsd] specifying an RNG
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I was wondering if the output would be a combination of a 
Ten Commandments and Roadmap.  (Note, ten is not a magic number)

The first part identifying the most common mistakes to avoid and what
approaches help to avoid that.
The second part pointing to organizations or bodies of work that can be
referenced to dive deeper.

Mike


-----Original Message-----
From: dsfjdssdfsd-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:dsfjdssdfsd-bounces@ietf.org] On
Behalf Of Yaron Sheffer
Sent: Friday, November 15, 2013 12:47 PM
To: Joseph Salowey (jsalowey)
Cc: <dsfjdssdfsd@ietf.org>; Dan Harkins
Subject: Re: [dsfjdssdfsd] specifying an RNG

Works for me, including the caveat on adopting an already vetted RNG.

	Yaron

On 11/15/2013 07:34 PM, Joseph Salowey (jsalowey) wrote:
>
> On Nov 15, 2013, at 9:21 AM, Yaron Sheffer <yaronf.ietf@gmail.com>
>   wrote:
>
>> Hi Dan,
>>
>> While I'm fully supportive of what you're out to achieve, I'm not clear
on what it is :-)
>>
>> Option A: specify requirements for an RNG (must mix multiple sources of
randomness, must survive state disclosure, the output must not reveal the
internal state for a standard attacker model, etc.)
>>
>
> [Joe] Yes
>
>> Option B1: specify the deterministic part of an RNG, i.e. the crypto
algorithm.
>>
>
> [Joe] Yes, except choose an exiting RNG and describe how to use it to meet
requirements in A
>
>> Option B2: specify the deterministic part, as well as the randomness
sources (I'm avoiding the E word...).
>>
>
> [Joe] While this is somewhat out of scope we ought to provide whatever
guidance we can so folks can avoid common implementation errors.  I think
there are useful recommendations we can make based on the list of issues
posted on a different thread.
>
>> Option A is important but most of us don't like requirements documents...
>>
>> Option B1 is certainly fun, but traditionally such work has not been done
in the IETF. In most cases we have recommended or adopted work done by other
standards bodies or even individual cryptographers.
>>
>> Option B2 is IMHO too OS-specific to be useful.
>>
>> So which is it?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>      Yaron
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>
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