Re: [dtn-interest] DTN architecture issues for handling Huge Content Objects

"Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <william.d.ivancic@nasa.gov> Wed, 05 December 2012 22:26 UTC

Return-Path: <william.d.ivancic@nasa.gov>
X-Original-To: dtn-interest@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dtn-interest@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA09721F8BB0 for <dtn-interest@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 5 Dec 2012 14:26:17 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.599
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3qs6h6-DVWdY for <dtn-interest@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 5 Dec 2012 14:26:17 -0800 (PST)
Received: from ndmsnpf02.ndc.nasa.gov (ndmsnpf02.ndc.nasa.gov [198.117.0.122]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 435A121F8BCD for <dtn-interest@irtf.org>; Wed, 5 Dec 2012 14:26:07 -0800 (PST)
Received: from ndjsppt03.ndc.nasa.gov (ndjsppt05.ndc.nasa.gov [198.117.1.104]) by ndmsnpf02.ndc.nasa.gov (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EF04108454; Wed, 5 Dec 2012 16:26:06 -0600 (CST)
Received: from ndjshub02.ndc.nasa.gov (ndjshub02-pub.ndc.nasa.gov [198.117.1.161]) by ndjsppt05.ndc.nasa.gov (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id qB5MQ0sY022472; Wed, 5 Dec 2012 16:26:06 -0600
Received: from NDJSSCC07.ndc.nasa.gov ([198.117.4.178]) by ndjshub02.ndc.nasa.gov ([198.117.1.161]) with mapi; Wed, 5 Dec 2012 16:26:02 -0600
From: "Ivancic, William D. (GRC-RHN0)" <william.d.ivancic@nasa.gov>
To: "Burleigh, Scott C" <scott.c.burleigh@jpl.nasa.gov>, John Zinky <jzinky@bbn.com>, "dtn-interest@irtf.org" <dtn-interest@irtf.org>
Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2012 16:26:10 -0600
Thread-Topic: [dtn-interest] DTN architecture issues for handling Huge Content Objects
Thread-Index: AQHN0x6pgX3sesyQTUmMe5vcZc+jL5gKqKnAgAAgJz8=
Message-ID: <CCE53432.D259%william.d.ivancic@nasa.gov>
In-Reply-To: <A5BEAD028815CB40A32A5669CF737C3B0FA0F473@ap-embx-sp40.RES.AD.JPL>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
user-agent: Microsoft-Entourage/13.11.0.110726
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10432:5.9.8185, 1.0.431, 0.0.0000 definitions=2012-12-05_09:2012-12-05, 2012-12-05, 1970-01-01 signatures=0
Subject: Re: [dtn-interest] DTN architecture issues for handling Huge Content Objects
X-BeenThere: dtn-interest@irtf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: "The Delay-Tolerant Networking Research Group \(DTNRG\) - Announce." <dtn-interest.irtf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/options/dtn-interest>, <mailto:dtn-interest-request@irtf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.irtf.org/mail-archive/web/dtn-interest>
List-Post: <mailto:dtn-interest@irtf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dtn-interest-request@irtf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/dtn-interest>, <mailto:dtn-interest-request@irtf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 05 Dec 2012 22:26:18 -0000

>>>>> Is this really true?  Payload size is an SDNV, and bundle
>>>>> fragmentation in DTN is pretty well defined; there's nothing in the
>>>>> spec to prevent you from sending a Huge Content item in a single
>>>>> bundle, then proactively fragmenting that bundle into N fragmentary
>>>>> bundles.  The fragments would then be forwarded to the destination
>>>>> endpoint, where their fragmentary payloads would be reassembled
>>>>> into the original Huge Content item for delivery.  In this sense,
>>>>> dealing with the end-to-end transfer of a group of related bundles has
>>>>> been covered by DTN for many years, right?
> 
> But Reactive Fragmentation  and proactive fragmentation in the middle of a
> transmission and Bundle Security do not mix.  FEC may not have this problem if
> done at the source.  It is analogous to proactive fragmentation then securing
> each bundle.
> 
>>>>     Will, I think that might well be an argument against doing reactive
>>>> fragmentation and/or mid-stream proactive fragmentation (though I'm not
>>>> altogether convinced of this).  But the fact remains that core BP already
>>>> handles end-to-end transfer of groups of related bundles, right?
> 
Scott, About 2008 or so we showed the usefulness of reactive fragmentation.
In a scheduled network where everything is know and transport delays between
systems may be long, reactive fragmentation may not be to useful, but for
opportunistic networks, reactive fragmentation is likely to be the norm.
You don't know how long the contact will be or when it will end.  You have
sent 7 Mbytes of a 10 Mbyte file.  It sure would be nice to just send the
remainder.  But BPS and reactive fragmentation don't mix in the current
design.

- Will