Re: [Dyncast] Continue questions for draft-li-dyncast-architecture-00

Lizhong Jin <lizhongj@qti.qualcomm.com> Tue, 16 March 2021 07:42 UTC

Return-Path: <lizhongj@qti.qualcomm.com>
X-Original-To: dyncast@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dyncast@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19BE13A1CB9 for <dyncast@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 00:42:27 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.998
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=qti.qualcomm.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3vevy5p5qSEu for <dyncast@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 00:42:25 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from alexa-out-sd-02.qualcomm.com (alexa-out-sd-02.qualcomm.com [199.106.114.39]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3FFBA3A1A44 for <dyncast@ietf.org>; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 00:42:25 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=qti.qualcomm.com; i=@qti.qualcomm.com; q=dns/txt; s=qcdkim; t=1615880545; x=1647416545; h=from:to:date:message-id:references:in-reply-to: mime-version:subject; bh=CVGLm08jfgC+dIIMCR+9QaoFNOOmhxO8dOy/JJvvwHs=; b=C3Tt6JF1/odnOSlJnh9YbXVjYBMNB4oIJ0y1kgU4I/9YGFeu+bbM5xzc H0E57qfvkVJt8DRn6+mhrlI4qhoN1AFfKyQIHd0AiVs8OsIqx1gbPk+Di uV17ZAPOlSW83ADcni5RLeYXOYYUva0/Aj4cspwNnkiNE5BAnuDF7W2y8 I=;
Thread-Topic: Continue questions for draft-li-dyncast-architecture-00
Received: from unknown (HELO ironmsg01-sd.qualcomm.com) ([10.53.140.141]) by alexa-out-sd-02.qualcomm.com with ESMTP; 16 Mar 2021 00:42:24 -0700
X-QCInternal: smtphost
Received: from nasanexm03g.na.qualcomm.com ([10.85.0.49]) by ironmsg01-sd.qualcomm.com with ESMTP/TLS/AES256-SHA; 16 Mar 2021 00:42:24 -0700
Received: from nasanexm03d.na.qualcomm.com (10.85.0.91) by nasanexm03g.na.qualcomm.com (10.85.0.49) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1497.2; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 00:42:24 -0700
Received: from NAM10-BN7-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (199.106.107.6) by nasanexm03d.na.qualcomm.com (10.85.0.91) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1497.2 via Frontend Transport; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 00:42:23 -0700
Received: from DM6PR02MB4458.namprd02.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:5:28::15) by DM6PR02MB4649.namprd02.prod.outlook.com (2603:10b6:5:21::30) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3933.32; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 07:42:19 +0000
Received: from DM6PR02MB4458.namprd02.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::11ff:1c67:630d:c8e4]) by DM6PR02MB4458.namprd02.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::11ff:1c67:630d:c8e4%5]) with mapi id 15.20.3933.032; Tue, 16 Mar 2021 07:42:19 +0000
From: Lizhong Jin <lizhongj@qti.qualcomm.com>
To: Luigi IANNONE <luigi.iannone@huawei.com>, "dyncast@ietf.org" <dyncast@ietf.org>
Thread-Index: AdcYEA2NXjca8LV6QCqg+EkVFi9mDwBZGufQADBlKrA=
Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 07:42:19 +0000
Message-ID: <DM6PR02MB44581B281989D2D93A0385E5E96B9@DM6PR02MB4458.namprd02.prod.outlook.com>
References: <DM6PR02MB44587A1E42BC29C0B156D023E96E9@DM6PR02MB4458.namprd02.prod.outlook.com> <663c132c3ff2482f851611bceb146180@huawei.com>
In-Reply-To: <663c132c3ff2482f851611bceb146180@huawei.com>
Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
authentication-results: huawei.com; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;huawei.com; dmarc=none action=none header.from=qti.qualcomm.com;
x-originating-ip: [199.106.103.52]
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 3ff699b9-9c0e-4051-af80-08d8e84f0732
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: DM6PR02MB4649:
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <DM6PR02MB46499F2B30C9799B670F41A4E96B9@DM6PR02MB4649.namprd02.prod.outlook.com>
x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:10000;
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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
x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; CTRY:; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; H:DM6PR02MB4458.namprd02.prod.outlook.com; PTR:; CAT:NONE; SFS:(4636009)(346002)(136003)(376002)(396003)(366004)(39860400002)(66574015)(66476007)(66446008)(33656002)(26005)(83380400001)(86362001)(110136005)(478600001)(64756008)(9686003)(5660300002)(71200400001)(52536014)(55016002)(8936002)(66946007)(7696005)(66556008)(76116006)(9326002)(53546011)(2906002)(316002)(6506007)(186003)(8676002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102;
x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata: 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
x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True
arc-seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=Lzm4RWP8QFdUKntfxofPPODkU8RTSxIpx94gskcl2ecze8L0wFYfPSngFhXPrWtP8pxqrhytO653p0JatBsIXBlqRcNXKJeqiQ4Lkx1Q3/IqYjlGy/vOO6w3PXYGVVeMfpjgaGZgWDSSYs7hdetb+GAS6qJAVi59HdPIIALjg+G5MyZ9/rbeXMtUAyLPl94HvBc+h5igg1Oa7l5NFaZihp2epVARjfS58Pf6sZ9x3QWuKp1zYrRuVmbYnAsogQRGJaQly2mci73alts8XSgSxVgpYltF5MLktNhXxRVj+RFR1CBZN/VQJTzm7VmXpWVJpfgGGTIo7aq3vINzE10/fQ==
arc-message-signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=GH+9dG2SJmL6MUEmSx9dJHYgmfhIbKXDGrRBU0N7Wi4=; b=TpJyHMOOxnt66Vlhj4/zuViXCZaoYW6SB3267Od0F8U2Agaihxj8EoG8BQ3JVGfvjXOrFnB+oKmS5yNj7B8nRLAGI3YlIKAHkckV7RCA4Zd51gmElSaRwZaJUZFRbrqgUihP6zOR85j5chG3f4Ojt7ZkCOtW14pA+nYDOn/aIOjeDQwByMiaude6L9I5t7y2rVDn3UM4bplCHyXOG3llVu28YTpmtK+K6/njZmggFvqzb501JXN2K32ToJz/G7Ysi0wObVYg+3s2RB568C+qtdbORjb2sb/46KoNW4FGGF+5HuxSaxk6jZBEPpzUAbCBz4WvtSJdkPbbsozaXq4dOw==
arc-authentication-results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=qti.qualcomm.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=qti.qualcomm.com; dkim=pass header.d=qti.qualcomm.com; arc=none
x-ms-exchange-crosstenant-authas: Internal
x-ms-exchange-crosstenant-authsource: DM6PR02MB4458.namprd02.prod.outlook.com
x-ms-exchange-crosstenant-network-message-id: 3ff699b9-9c0e-4051-af80-08d8e84f0732
x-ms-exchange-crosstenant-originalarrivaltime: 16 Mar 2021 07:42:19.3008 (UTC)
x-ms-exchange-crosstenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
x-ms-exchange-crosstenant-id: 98e9ba89-e1a1-4e38-9007-8bdabc25de1d
x-ms-exchange-crosstenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED
x-ms-exchange-crosstenant-userprincipalname: bubvgijqsKfyXDJiZ8u1EShNMNh4ntqed4HSZHKHf1anK4ztFFlAJ+r1pHH6o2hxSqCEJySTfYzqX+Z+HfRPA5x7virlE5yToQ6yI8j2ntw=
x-ms-exchange-transport-crosstenantheadersstamped: DM6PR02MB4649
x-originatororg: qti.qualcomm.com
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_DM6PR02MB44581B281989D2D93A0385E5E96B9DM6PR02MB4458namp_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dyncast/XIRSAFrz3equ-FyHJS1O85PiWWE>
Subject: Re: [Dyncast] Continue questions for draft-li-dyncast-architecture-00
X-BeenThere: dyncast@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: <dyncast.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dyncast>, <mailto:dyncast-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dyncast/>
List-Post: <mailto:dyncast@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dyncast-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dyncast>, <mailto:dyncast-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 07:42:27 -0000

Hi Luigi,
Thanks for the reply and see inline below. I understand these are potential working items. And I hope to see some potential approaches to some problems, which I believe would be more convincing to be a WG.

Regards
Lizhong

From: Luigi IANNONE <luigi.iannone@huawei.com>
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2021 16:38
To: Lizhong Jin <lizhongj@qti.qualcomm.com>; dyncast@ietf.org
Subject: [EXT] RE: Continue questions for draft-li-dyncast-architecture-00

Hi,

Thank you for your interesting questions.
The fall a bit on the solution side, hence there is no confirmed answer that can be provided.
These are all potential work items that need a larger discussion.
I provide my personal point of view inline.

Ciao

L.


From: Dyncast [mailto:dyncast-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Lizhong Jin
Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2021 15:15
To: dyncast@ietf.org<mailto:dyncast@ietf.org>
Subject: [Dyncast] Continue questions for draft-li-dyncast-architecture-00

Hi all,
Thanks for the presentations. I still have some questions left, and would like to post them here.

  1.  How to identify a new flow for a service? By mismatching the binding table?
[Luigi] Yes, this can be considered one way of doing it assuming there is a binding table providing flow affinity.
[Lizhong] Thanks


  1.  How to identify an end of flow? Timing out a flow would sometimes be dangerous. What if the flow continues while the flow entry has been timed out? For TCP, you could simply using FIN packet instead of timeout. But what to do for UDP?
[Luigi] Interesting question. I do not think there is a generic way to understand when a UDP flows ends. There might be some action that can be taken if the type of flow is known, but the danger in this way is to have too many corner cases.
[Lizhong] Yes, no better idea based on current protocol.


  1.  How to setup and maintain the same instance affinity for the application with multiple flows? E.g., FTP connection setup with two 5-tuple flows. How would D-Router know the two flows should maintain the same service instance?
[Luigi] Interesting question. To be honest I never thought about such a case. On the other hand, how often this can happen?
[Lizhong] I am not sure, but there exists such application.


  1.  Regarding the Figure 1: Dyncast Architecture, does Dyncast provide end-to-end guarantee for service quality? I ask this question because I don't see how to setup a guarantee path between service instance and D-Router, client and D-Router.
[Luigi] No. There was never the idea to guarantee any form of QoS.
[Lizhong] OK. Thanks.

Regards
Lizhong