IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [Eligibility-discuss] don't repeat what's not changing in 8713: Ineligibility by being a board/group member.

Luc André Burdet <laburdet.ietf@gmail.com> Thu, 22 September 2022 12:30 UTC

Return-Path: <laburdet.ietf@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: eligibility-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: eligibility-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E97FC1522A1 for <eligibility-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 22 Sep 2022 05:30:13 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.108
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.108 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sa4-MxG5Ou1n for <eligibility-discuss@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 22 Sep 2022 05:30:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-il1-x129.google.com (mail-il1-x129.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::129]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2A92DC14CE2E for <eligibility-discuss@ietf.org>; Thu, 22 Sep 2022 05:30:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-il1-x129.google.com with SMTP id h14so994039ila.12 for <eligibility-discuss@ietf.org>; Thu, 22 Sep 2022 05:30:11 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:content-language:accept-language:in-reply-to :references:message-id:date:thread-index:thread-topic:subject:cc:to :from:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=34Kr1Y2DHxlgnOCdoqJInNpI0aTQtoA+joZJXKsdh6E=; b=mIihkTvLKR8atAYBAK9kqK2QDZ6RpwYJu7yDGSi+ut82KWSceKWcE0HZEVisHANQ+0 OXopkwjQd2+Vwpe3XotzIZbS24r3ZbSdm3926pEWpI2zdnXRRW3K8dYCqgLzX5VFc/HT +UZ0nI5VtpxnYqzJbT9yWdAjPv8urZzC3PoWx9RrqRCMtGbL3LWxTk8gxfIHOlS6D+hL 4eM6e2Q53WNU3sv/ahWJ/h0dpNjbyStYJWBGeg9t25EDwjims7k4U5liwI1PFy15WzVH ByCgrZPYZrwMruXyy9Y6AKrH1tlGkf3vcykzo2ZbcxT3nlAA+dh5Kdy2ray7rgLv6hwO fyFg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=mime-version:content-language:accept-language:in-reply-to :references:message-id:date:thread-index:thread-topic:subject:cc:to :from:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date; bh=34Kr1Y2DHxlgnOCdoqJInNpI0aTQtoA+joZJXKsdh6E=; b=X4KP/SKo9KMl6pZHOwLr9K5ghY2jp+IJ+rEEYXmB3oEFObth+3p/mAUlDw/k+Tesgg T0f17sNhsgSywR3eGKrdvGApywqmH2hHSXQJTrl5WBKCCOgd9NyBQlxPEj+IcGObZNW1 c02NU6jZnim9kuN6puMf6xnaUIrmYUcFYKQ3KgN5MurOfNL0oNTZobeNljT2SMOCslH0 z3B8/xlpRmkfXpkoJ+BSQf71oBL3NwfqwaPgkPhYUfkOLAKVwHKG6vTqHIemvy3jItH6 GEh//pEqI6Qaq4Kbd04pBMiw3KHt4Cqp0JIP77xpJfBEOEJlyM6bNhKTEHxPNAsPxiMD YANw==
X-Gm-Message-State: ACrzQf34vFXst0XlN2O85T0Jsje8k+P4L43vHk00QwD83cDAM/TyC8Po nOrhurEn3EaG2D4+JlsMt3IwoavdLqs=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMsMyM6pfCUwPST+/fJIzuGzaW4WnNJdYpfDdtZJOuqzRiV5YbhO4sIzRjYtkjP6B4LUv/Z3800KhQ==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6e02:2145:b0:2f4:8c94:dcbc with SMTP id d5-20020a056e02214500b002f48c94dcbcmr1474595ilv.161.1663849810321; Thu, 22 Sep 2022 05:30:10 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from DM8P221MB0454.NAMP221.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([2603:1036:301:2847::5]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w71-20020a025d4a000000b0035834aa2213sm2108850jaa.95.2022.09.22.05.30.09 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 22 Sep 2022 05:30:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Luc André Burdet <laburdet.ietf@gmail.com>
To: Lars Eggert <lars@eggert.org>, John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>
CC: Barry Leiba <barryleiba@computer.org>, Martin Duke <martin.h.duke@gmail.com>, Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com>, "eligibility-discuss@ietf.org" <eligibility-discuss@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Eligibility-discuss] don't repeat what's not changing in 8713: Ineligibility by being a board/group member.
Thread-Index: AQHYzP1ASaEmSkIbzkWXV9mTAFP2+K3pB1cAgACCGYCAAK1ggIAAypCAgABgz4E=
X-MS-Exchange-MessageSentRepresentingType: 1
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2022 12:30:09 +0000
Message-ID: <DM8P221MB045463F796A1474AF4D864B9AF4E9@DM8P221MB0454.NAMP221.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM>
References: <CAM4esxSNzWQ1+0ppjTeOqnUvju09-Nshm7sWq_Yx=u5YikJT=g@mail.gmail.com> <75c01ef9-8384-2784-c14d-7781ff51657c@nostrum.com> <CAM4esxRXAcB6Q8Ea36nPUX9AzjmiemA=1+_UAa=wMN=JsaAVuw@mail.gmail.com> <CALaySJJQOXF8uQoWDKTt-0Xpin1C14E0D=m3HWZY5dOgO2xTLA@mail.gmail.c om> <67C640F419A6D42216A93B56@PSB> <C3835739-DA56-40BA-9396-3F0E37ED5696@eggert.org>
In-Reply-To: <C3835739-DA56-40BA-9396-3F0E37ED5696@eggert.org>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-CA
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-Exchange-Organization-SCL: -1
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
X-MS-Exchange-Organization-RecordReviewCfmType: 0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_DM8P221MB045463F796A1474AF4D864B9AF4E9DM8P221MB0454NAMP_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/eligibility-discuss/KhIiz3iKgi1BORX-2dYd38dY1HM>
Subject: Re: [Eligibility-discuss] don't repeat what's not changing in 8713: Ineligibility by being a board/group member.
X-BeenThere: eligibility-discuss@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF eligibility procedures <eligibility-discuss.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/eligibility-discuss>, <mailto:eligibility-discuss-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/eligibility-discuss/>
List-Post: <mailto:eligibility-discuss@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:eligibility-discuss-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/eligibility-discuss>, <mailto:eligibility-discuss-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2022 12:30:13 -0000

Given I had the same feedback on an initial reading (4.15 updates) I think the document needs to be clear that its scope is replacing 4.14 and all other mentions of eligibility restrictions are ‘repeated here for legibility and completeness only’ .

>From my thread the “R1 and R3” need to be very clear that they’re just repeated but R2 is the real and only update.
In prose though.

Regards,
Luc André

Luc André Burdet |  Cisco  |  laburdet.ietf@gmail.com  |  Tel: +1 613 254 4814


From: Eligibility-discuss <eligibility-discuss-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Lars Eggert <lars@eggert.org>
Date: Thursday, September 22, 2022 at 02:37
To: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>
Cc: Barry Leiba <barryleiba@computer.org>, Martin Duke <martin.h.duke@gmail.com>, Robert Sparks <rjsparks@nostrum.com>, eligibility-discuss@ietf.org <eligibility-discuss@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Eligibility-discuss] don't repeat what's not changing in 8713: Ineligibility by being a board/group member.
Hi,

AD hat on.

On 2022-9-21, at 21:31, John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com> wrote:
> FWIW, there is an argument for completely replacing 8713 rather
> than adjusting things where needed but relying on it for
> everything else.

There is that argument, and it was brought up in discussion, but:

> While I suspect it would be impractical given the schedule,

This. We need to have a specific fix in place by the time the next NomCom cycle starts, and I believe this will not be possible if we open up all of 8713.

> If we cannot do that,
> the second-best (and more practical) option would be to make it
> extremely clear that one looks in this document for a complete
> replacement for Section 4.14 (and maybe 4.15, see below) of RFC
> 8713 and that 8713 is authoritative for everything else.

That seems like an actionable suggestion, and your text suggestion (which I cut) looks reasonable to me.

I'm open to discussing a rechartering of the WG to do other changes to the NomCom eligibility criteria after it has delivered its chartered work item, but not before.

Thanks,
Lars

v2.28.0 | Report a Bug | By Email | System Status