Re: [Fud] Charter Text

Hannes Tschofenig <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net> Thu, 10 August 2017 11:47 UTC

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To: Olaf Bergmann <bergmann@tzi.org>
Cc: Emmanuel Baccelli <Emmanuel.Baccelli@inria.fr>, fud@ietf.org
References: <8f8528da-d1eb-08c7-b3fe-b1f4febed595@gmx.net> <CANK0pbbbgEONiCeuQGOuRO9Gq62RpAVhh53xLxd5JOMQtJg-_g@mail.gmail.com> <87d187oehr.fsf@aung.informatik.uni-bremen.de> <56ebab2e-86d2-bab4-be48-303fc0da0c81@gmx.net> <87poc6l4et.fsf@aung.informatik.uni-bremen.de>
From: Hannes Tschofenig <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
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Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2017 13:47:36 +0200
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Subject: Re: [Fud] Charter Text
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Hi Olaf,

a few remarks below.

On 08/08/2017 12:50 PM, Olaf Bergmann wrote:
> Hi Hannes,
> 
> Hannes Tschofenig <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net> writes:
> 
>> I believe Emmanuel needs to tell us a bit more about the use case he has
>> in mind.
> 
> And of course others as well. Hannes did a good outline of what he
> thinks should be addressed. Those who have use cases that are not
> covered by this should speak up.

Certainly.

> 
>> The use cases I would like to cover are:
>>
>> - a developer creates a single firmware image, which may consist of
>> source code from various parties and may also contain binaries from
>> third parties.
>>
>> - a developer creates multiple firmware images (since the device has
>> multiple microcontrollers that need to be updated).
>>
>> In this model the update service on a microcontroller gets code from a
>> single source only (at least for the device it appears so since it does
>> not know whether an included library was written by a different developer).
> 
> Yes, I agree in principle.
> 
> What we have seen (not only at the IOTSU workshop but also on existing
> devices such as VoIP phones) is that firmware updates typically do not
> come as a monolithic package but that in modules that can be updated
> separately (the most common---and desirable---split is between the OS
> and the basic bootloader). I think that at least this should be
> addressed here.

FWIW I would not consider VoIP phones in scope of the devices we would
be looking at.

I also recall discussions at the IoTSU workshop but I remember that
there was some confusion between the concept of a monolithic firmware
images and what is actually sent over the wire (full image vs.
differential updates). I don't think we ever talked about bootloaders
vs. the rest of the OS.

> 
>> What I specifically want to exclude is a model like JavaScript where you
>> can get code from multiple different sources dynamically during code
>> execution.
> 
> I agree as well.
> 
> Grüße
> Olaf
> 

Ciao
Hannes