Re: [gaia] Heterogeneity in network capacity: growing?

Mirjam Kuehne <mir@ripe.net> Tue, 01 March 2016 14:17 UTC

Return-Path: <mir@ripe.net>
X-Original-To: gaia@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: gaia@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CCE51A884F for <gaia@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 1 Mar 2016 06:17:49 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.906
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.906 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.006] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gN5bRLwUdZzO for <gaia@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 1 Mar 2016 06:17:47 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mahimahi.ripe.net (mahimahi.ripe.net [IPv6:2001:67c:2e8:11::c100:1372]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7D7111A8838 for <gaia@irtf.org>; Tue, 1 Mar 2016 06:17:46 -0800 (PST)
Received: from titi.ripe.net ([193.0.23.11]) by mahimahi.ripe.net with esmtps (TLSv1.2:DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.84) (envelope-from <mir@ripe.net>) id 1aal7N-0008Jm-Ha; Tue, 01 Mar 2016 15:17:45 +0100
Received: from sslvpn.ipv6.ripe.net ([2001:67c:2e8:9::c100:14e6] helo=guest179.guestnet.ripe.net) by titi.ripe.net with esmtps (UNKNOWN:AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.72) (envelope-from <mir@ripe.net>) id 1aal7N-0007yK-Cj; Tue, 01 Mar 2016 15:17:41 +0100
To: Michael Welzl <michawe@ifi.uio.no>
References: <32116_1456700693_56D37D15_32116_453_1_CF23F499-41D1-4DA6-A306-8924DC4F4DB4@ifi.uio.no> <41954A84-EFF0-4107-9859-E60AAC65285C@aalto.fi> <56F64461-28A0-4E5E-9923-D177B663EFB7@ifi.uio.no> <e3a59b97b74543a7960911bc155e8830@rew09926dag05b.domain1.systemhost.net> <E41521ED-AA4F-4AE5-BA02-6BD7B7DFC621@ifi.uio.no> <EE9E048C-DD05-4DB3-929F-DF337355DC90@isoc.org> <56D59D94.2090109@ripe.net> <44250FD7-84FD-4A9F-B133-8B6682BF278F@ifi.uio.no>
From: Mirjam Kuehne <mir@ripe.net>
Message-ID: <56D5A485.6080503@ripe.net>
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2016 15:17:41 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.10; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.6.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <44250FD7-84FD-4A9F-B133-8B6682BF278F@ifi.uio.no>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-ACL-Warn: Delaying message
X-RIPE-Spam-Level: --
X-RIPE-Spam-Report: Spam Total Points: -2.9 points pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- ------------------------------------ -1.0 ALL_TRUSTED Passed through trusted hosts only via SMTP -0.0 RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay domain -1.9 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000]
X-RIPE-Signature: 7e0932718cf60c1d07d29cd25dae927445ccddc48f89865f99b1d45e254a3488
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/gaia/5EZPGxMYuFOXJk-QqFkJnvQSl2E>
Cc: gaia@irtf.org
Subject: Re: [gaia] Heterogeneity in network capacity: growing?
X-BeenThere: gaia@irtf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Global Access to the Internet for All <gaia.irtf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/options/gaia>, <mailto:gaia-request@irtf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/gaia/>
List-Post: <mailto:gaia@irtf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gaia-request@irtf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/gaia>, <mailto:gaia-request@irtf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Mar 2016 14:17:49 -0000

Hi Michael,

You are right: RIPE Atlas doesn't measure bandwidth but I thought
measuring latency could add another aspect to the question.

Kind regards,
Mirjam


On 1/3/16 15:04, Michael Welzl wrote:
> Thanks a lot for that pointer too!
> I know about the RIPE atlas and do find it very interesting.
> 
> However, probably I'm missing something - how is the traceroute dataset relevant for what I'm asking?
> My question is about link bandwidth...
> 
> 
>> On 01 Mar 2016, at 14:48, Mirjam Kuehne <mir@ripe.net> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Thanks to Jane Coffin for pointing me to this discussion.
>>
>> You might also want to have a look at the RIPE Atlas system, a worldwide
>> active measurements network: https://atlas.ripe.net/
>>
>> While we don't actually measure bandwidth, the thousands of RIPE Atlas
>> measurement probes regularly send pings and traceroutes (and also SSL,
>> DNS queries) to certain pre-defined destinations on the Internet.
>> Especially the traceroute results could be interesting for the questions
>> below.
>>
>> The measurement results are public and are used by many researchers and
>> operators for various use cases. Have a look at this blog for some
>> inspiration: https://labs.ripe.net/atlas
>>
>> If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact me directly.
>>
>> Kind regards,
>> Mirjam Kuehne
>> RIPE NCC
>>
>>>
>>> On 2/29/16, 2:59 PM, "gaia on behalf of Michael Welzl" <gaia-bounces@irtf.org on behalf of michawe@ifi.uio.no> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Great, thanks!
>>>>
>>>> Good thinking about Akamai’s report - of course! I should have looked at that first
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 29. feb. 2016, at 19.22, achilles.petras@bt.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Michael
>>>>>
>>>>> A good starting point is Ofcom's infrastructure annual report; here is the 2015 one:
>>>>> http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/binaries/research/infrastructure/2015/downloads/connected_nations2015.pdf
>>>>>
>>>>> You will find several distribution graphs like the one in Figure 4 that compares the monthly usage to the access speed range for 2014 and 2015.
>>>>>
>>>>> You could also find the reports from previous years to see how things have changed over time:
>>>>> http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/market-data-research/market-data/infrastructure/?a=0
>>>>>
>>>>> For a more global point of view, you could check Akamai's State of the Internet Report:
>>>>> https://www.stateoftheinternet.com/resources-connectivity-2015-q3-state-of-the-internet-report.html
>>>>>
>>>>> or play with their visualisations:
>>>>> https://www.stateoftheinternet.com/trends-visualizations-connectivity-global-heat-map-internet-speeds-broadband-adoption.html
>>>>>
>>>>> Hope this helps
>>>>> Achilles
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: gaia [mailto:gaia-bounces@irtf.org] On Behalf Of Michael Welzl
>>>>> Sent: 29 February 2016 08:16
>>>>> To: Manner Jukka <jukka.manner@aalto.fi>
>>>>> Cc: gaia@irtf.org
>>>>> Subject: Re: [gaia] Heterogeneity in network capacity: growing?
>>>>>
>>>>> First,
>>>>>
>>>>> Apologies for asking first formulating a question in two ways with contradictory outcomes (yes/no) and then saying "I guess the answer is no" - that was confusing!  :)   I was tired when I wrote it...
>>>>> so I meant the second question, i.e. my guess was also that heterogeneity *is* growing.
>>>>>
>>>>> How would you calculate if there was data: I guess what I'm interested in is bandwidth statistics: how often do we see a bottleneck of X bit/s? The Internet-wide distribution of X is what I'm looking for...
>>>>>
>>>>> Depending on area/market: I'd also be happy to have X for India, X for Europe, X for ... whatever. It's a start!
>>>>> Ideally citable - some publicly available study I could refer to.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Michael
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 29 Feb 2016, at 08:33, Manner Jukka <jukka.manner@aalto.fi> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would say yes, they are globally, but it also depends on what area/market you are talking about. How would you calculate it if there was data? I have data, but not sure how to calculate this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> cheers,
>>>>>> Jukka
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 29 Feb 2016, at 01:04, Michael Welzl <michawe@ifi.uio.no> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I guess this is probably the right group to ask: is the heterogeneity of link bandwidths growing?
>>>>>>> Another way of asking this is: across the whole Internet, do old links roughly get removed as quickly as capacities grow?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I guess the answer is no - but are there any good citable references for this? Data?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>> Michael
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> gaia mailing list
>>>>>>> gaia@irtf.org
>>>>>>> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/gaia
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> gaia mailing list
>>>>> gaia@irtf.org
>>>>> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/gaia
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> gaia mailing list
>>>> gaia@irtf.org
>>>> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/gaia
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> gaia mailing list
>> gaia@irtf.org
>> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/gaia
>