IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [Gendispatch] First comments on draft-rsalz-2028bis-00.txt

"Salz, Rich" <rsalz@akamai.com> Thu, 09 September 2021 12:54 UTC

Return-Path: <rsalz@akamai.com>
X-Original-To: gendispatch@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: gendispatch@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E9E93A0A87 for <gendispatch@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 9 Sep 2021 05:54:52 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.551
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.551 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.452, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=akamai.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kD3GZPqTdMtY for <gendispatch@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 9 Sep 2021 05:54:49 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com [IPv6:2620:100:9001:583::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 06B573A0A78 for <gendispatch@ietf.org>; Thu, 9 Sep 2021 05:54:48 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from pps.filterd (m0122332.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com (8.16.1.2/8.16.0.43) with SMTP id 189Bx2SB000452; Thu, 9 Sep 2021 13:54:45 +0100
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=akamai.com; h=from : to : cc : subject : date : message-id : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-id : content-transfer-encoding : mime-version; s=jan2016.eng; bh=wJazoPKWWT+oGmbZfC8DGLJp4ERUMGV/WHmW1qojUdM=; b=eDH/axXjgV1MSm2Yx22eWNKvL45TPClw8MdjyxKe+/k1HjDk1Osh8ok2zmiYsYZBR+5V 2YSVf8RwkBrt/NpdRUxD+9n/IVM8l7EpuBsXidDGwKfdMC8uoq6QaLAdUcGjhHmANH56 P7cnSnVUyPn4066nmIUWH0xV5dya+6Lo97TiRSFw79JRVDw4tNjRAlzHz3KohFe36dSH 50DIuv6RyA57CuTsj423ycJaMN2OIi/Xvne9ZX8N/84spIFAfYyFxC11E2Ap7s918gUJ fF73SuCCv8sXQQ3Hw7k1H+YefbkSZ/ZI0F4342aEIO5ySYsC1yzh24e/VhbxmYPeXE9C Qw==
Received: from prod-mail-ppoint5 (prod-mail-ppoint5.akamai.com [184.51.33.60] (may be forged)) by mx0a-00190b01.pphosted.com with ESMTP id 3ayhv915wx-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 09 Sep 2021 13:54:45 +0100
Received: from pps.filterd (prod-mail-ppoint5.akamai.com [127.0.0.1]) by prod-mail-ppoint5.akamai.com (8.16.1.2/8.16.1.2) with SMTP id 189Cp236018683; Thu, 9 Sep 2021 05:54:44 -0700
Received: from email.msg.corp.akamai.com ([172.27.123.30]) by prod-mail-ppoint5.akamai.com with ESMTP id 3axctrk34g-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 09 Sep 2021 05:54:44 -0700
Received: from USMA1EX-DAG1MB1.msg.corp.akamai.com (172.27.123.101) by usma1ex-dag1mb1.msg.corp.akamai.com (172.27.123.101) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1497.23; Thu, 9 Sep 2021 08:54:43 -0400
Received: from USMA1EX-DAG1MB1.msg.corp.akamai.com ([172.27.123.101]) by usma1ex-dag1mb1.msg.corp.akamai.com ([172.27.123.101]) with mapi id 15.00.1497.023; Thu, 9 Sep 2021 08:54:43 -0400
From: "Salz, Rich" <rsalz@akamai.com>
To: Rob Sayre <sayrer@gmail.com>, Brian Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
CC: "gendispatch@ietf.org" <gendispatch@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Gendispatch] First comments on draft-rsalz-2028bis-00.txt
Thread-Index: AQHXoeLe7PMKBPk/m0u4Pw5oGin24KuY1geAgAIJP4CAAAQtAIAABL0AgADHwAA=
Date: Thu, 09 Sep 2021 12:54:42 +0000
Message-ID: <F5B86774-F7ED-4E13-9D93-AF0762AE4C1B@akamai.com>
References: <163069758370.6471.14990302329155864755@ietfa.amsl.com> <A21C8B4C-C2E1-4C4D-AB6F-C3C2FF5BF23A@akamai.com> <9b9c0e2d-c997-431c-6cc0-326b85992c72@lear.ch> <84a84b50-e8ce-da68-9115-83b392043683@gmail.com> <18205B44-72C5-4A59-93F4-A39FEA3384A1@akamai.com> <CALaySJLTUHj6ZJ8Yn_99nQLN3g8h00R7w6+4NoEa3-SAf6KQgQ@mail.gmail.com> <CAChr6SwfSnNsiDssk7Z9j_wP4aHHv7UC60QRHrGKEC2L3S36KQ@mail.gmail.com> <a22d97e8-512b-8749-5727-eb93bc481f06@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <a22d97e8-512b-8749-5727-eb93bc481f06@gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/16.53.21090101
x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1
x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted
x-originating-ip: [172.27.164.43]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-ID: <901B95E8B0E6774C8390F2FF20EE00C3@akamai.com>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.391, 18.0.790 definitions=2021-09-09_04:2021-09-09, 2021-09-09 signatures=0
X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 mlxscore=0 adultscore=0 spamscore=0 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 mlxlogscore=931 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2109030001 definitions=main-2109090078
X-Proofpoint-GUID: g7siwSAymb2UsvmDbMgoRYRmXcnl-d26
X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: g7siwSAymb2UsvmDbMgoRYRmXcnl-d26
X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=baseguard engine=ICAP:2.0.182.1,Aquarius:18.0.790,Hydra:6.0.391,FMLib:17.0.607.475 definitions=2021-09-09_04,2021-09-09_01,2020-04-07_01
X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 bulkscore=0 impostorscore=0 phishscore=0 mlxlogscore=929 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 priorityscore=1501 adultscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 malwarescore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2109030001 definitions=main-2109090079
X-Agari-Authentication-Results: mx.akamai.com; spf=${SPFResult} (sender IP is 184.51.33.60) smtp.mailfrom=rsalz@akamai.com smtp.helo=prod-mail-ppoint5
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/gendispatch/0yinHzoiYcTZBIqBROpyg_aswAk>
Subject: Re: [Gendispatch] First comments on draft-rsalz-2028bis-00.txt
X-BeenThere: gendispatch@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: General Area Dispatch <gendispatch.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/gendispatch>, <mailto:gendispatch-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/gendispatch/>
List-Post: <mailto:gendispatch@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gendispatch-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gendispatch>, <mailto:gendispatch-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 09 Sep 2021 12:54:52 -0000

    > By writing it all down, Rich seems to have shown that some of these relationships are absurdly complex.

I don't see it as absurdly complex, far from it. You need to separate the "control plane" (how people are picked for positions) from the "data plane" (how documents flow through to become RFC's). Perhaps the doc could be more clear about that.  What do you think is absurdly complex, ideally in the data plane part.

> We have a plate of our own spaghetti to sort out first: https://www.ietf.org/standards/process/informal/

Ideally, once this draft gets adopted and then published, that page basically goes away and points to the document.  We already have the Tao. Write things once.

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email