Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD
Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net> Tue, 17 October 2023 00:47 UTC
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From: Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>
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Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2023 20:47:51 -0400
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To: Roman Danyliw <rdd@cert.org>
Cc: Martin Duke <martin.h.duke@gmail.com>, gendispatch@ietf.org, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD
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I'm getting somewhat tired of tracking this, and am not sure if people are actually using / reviewing the data. Last week I worked 67h 20m. Of that 35h 22min (or 52.5%) was IETF time. #Exported data from October 8, 2023 to October 14, 2023 #Exported on October 16, 2023 #Duration formatted as H:mm (e.g. 0:26) #Times rounded to nearest minute #Activity,Group,Duration,Percentage Email - Misc 1:24:00 2% Document Progression IETF 3:59:00 7% Email IETF 18:42:00 33% Meetings IETF 3:13:00 6% NOC IETF 2:57:00 5% Technology Deep Dives IETF 0:59:00 2% Misc - Administrivia 3:41:00 6% Misc - Misc 0:27:00 1% W On Sun, Oct 08, 2023 at 12:23 PM, Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net> wrote: > … and, as per usual, Roman's thoroughness and detail makes me look like a > slacker :-). > > Below is my time from last week (Oct 1 - Oct 7th). > Last week was unusual, as I participated in the ICANN Name Collisions > Analysis Project (NCAP) workshop in Washington D.C. Because of this I > spent much more time on ICANN stuff than usual, and also missed the IESG > Telechat. Some time was also "wasted" in travels, side meetings, etc. > > #Exported data from October 1, 2023 to October 7, 2023 > > Email / Research- Corp: 2:00:00 > Misc - Email: 10:18:00 > ICANN - Name Collisions: 11:57:00 > ICANN - SSAC: 1:47:00 > IETF - Document Progression: 0:25:00 > IETF - Document Review: 3:50:00 > IETF - Email: 9:35:00 > IETF - IESG Discussions: 2:30:00 > IETF - Misc: 0:10:00 > IETF - NOC: 1:42:00 > Misc - Administrivia 0:11:00 > Misc - Misc 4:16:00 > > Total working hours: 48:41:00 > IETF time: 28:30:00 > % IETF: 58.54% > > Once again, because of the nature of email, I'm counting both "Misc-Email" > and "IETF-Email" as IETF time (looking at my mail stats, the huge majority > is from @ietf.org, or directly related to IETF, so I feel justified in > doing so). > > W > > > > > > On Wed, Oct 04, 2023 at 9:09 AM, Roman Danyliw <rdd@cert.org> wrote: > >> >> >> My narrative version of being AD, https://github.com/rdanyliw/ietf-notes/ >> blob/main/SEC-AD-role-perspective.md, recently sent to SAAG (https:// >> mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/saag/7VtuR41OM08dlZcy57CYj7pnlvg/) >> >> >> >> Roman >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* iesg <iesg-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of * Warren Kumari >> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 3, 2023 11:01 AM >> *To:* Martin Duke <martin.h.duke@gmail.com> >> *Cc:* gendispatch@ietf.org; The IESG <iesg@ietf.org> >> *Subject:* Re: How I spend my time as an AD >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> … and here is some additional data to try and give a flavor of what I'm >> spending my IETF time on. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Note that this is only my IETF time, plus "Email - Misc" (because much of >> this is intermixed with IETF stuff). >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> #Exported data from September 24, 2023 to September 30, 2023 >> >> >> >> #Duration formatted as Text (e.g. 0h 26m) >> >> >> >> #Times rounded to nearest minute >> >> >> >> #Activity,Duration,Percentage >> >> >> >> Email - Misc,6h 49m >> >> >> >> IETF: Document Progression,2h 05m >> >> >> >> IETF: Email ,13h 42m >> >> >> >> IETF: Meetings,3h 21m,9 >> >> >> >> IETF: Misc,0h 33m >> >> >> >> IETF: NOC,2h 46m >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> It looks like I spent ~29h 16m on IETF stuff, and the majority (20h 30m) >> was spent on email. >> >> >> >> This was out of ~50h worked total, so IETF related stuff took ~76% of my >> time. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Much of this is squishy time — for example, I was doing IETF: Email while >> participating in an ICANN Workshop, so I was only partially present in >> either…. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> W >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Thu, Sep 21, 2023 at 11:57 AM, Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, Sep 19, 2023 at 1:01 PM, Martin Duke <martin.h.duke@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Some people in the community are interested in how ADs spend their time. >> Here is a data point. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> … and here is some data from me: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ >> 15vSsL_aD2sMb_SFXmvlXwf781xZ4SfLqT-Mf5YavKqI/edit?usp=sharing >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Note: I only did this for 2 days, shortly after a meeting - this means >> that it isn't hugely representative of an "average" week, but it hopefully >> at least give a flavor. One thing that I discovered while collecting this >> data is just how much overhead it involved (which is why it is only 2 days >> :-)). I'm somewhat ADHD, and the context switching of "Do something, record >> something, do something, record something" was crushing. It was also very >> unclear how I would count almost all of the items. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> As an example, after aggressive filtering I get ~250 emails per day - >> these are spread across email lists which I'm on because I'm an AD, email >> lists which I'd read anyway, ICANN mail, corporate mail, etc. If I read an >> email about a draft in DNSOP, is that AD time? Or is general IETF time? I'd >> probably read it even if I wasn't DNSOP AD, but I'd also likely pay less >> attention to some of the less interesting replies… >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Yesterday I mentioned an OpsAWG draft on the NANOG list - https:// >> mailman.nanog.org/pipermail/nanog/2023-September/223301.html . Do I >> count that as AD / IESG time? I'll end up progressing the document, but I >> also happen to believe that this draft is really useful, and I would have >> reported on it either way, so perhaps it's just general IETF time? >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On a personal note, I am fairly disappointed (and somewhat hurt) that >> instead of just *asking* how I spend my time, a BoF was proposed. To me at >> least, this felt like "Not only are you doing this wrong, but it is so >> wrong that your input is not useful or needed. We'll design a timecard for >> you to fill in, and make sure your TPS report is on my desk by Friday." >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> W >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I am not including the time I spend as a normal IETF participant: writing >> drafts, participating in WGs I would attend anyway, and attending IETF >> plenary meetings. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> These percentages are a rough fraction of a 40-hour workweek, averaged >> over the year. I did a time card for my own information three years ago, >> long since lost, but this is an estimate based on a little reflection on >> the tasks I perform. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 8% - Meetings: Telechats, a weekly sync with my co-AD, occasional >> one-offs for IEEE syncs, BOF reviews, etc >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 2% - WG management - finding chairs, occasional 1-on-1s, chartering, >> errata, BoFs, monitoring mailing lists, etc. Personally, I tend not to wade >> into WG document threads very much, to keep my perspective clear for the AD >> review. Others may differ. There was a period I spent about 5% of my time >> clearing the errata backlog, but that is long past. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> In transport, we do not get many BoFs. I have also been fortunate in >> having great WG chairs that can handle most problems, so thank you to them. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 3% - AD [document] Evaluation -- With only 5 WGs, I do not have many of >> these. I take these really seriously and a review usually takes the better >> part of a day, sometimes more. Other ADs almost certainly spend more time >> because they have many more documents. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 3% - Standards process management: actively participating in policy work >> -- IESG statements and such -- is essentially optional. I have gotten >> interested in certain initiatives. It is certainly possible to spend more >> or less time on this. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 2% - Retreats. These meetings essentially take a full week, but are >> happening only once per year. You could put this in the "standards process >> management" bin if you like. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 10% - IESG review - Until about a year ago, this consumed substantially >> more time for me, as much as 40-50%. For multiple reasons, I've trimmed >> this down to focus on documents with transport implications (which is not >> many of them). In the context of any particular review, I've reduced my >> focus to major problems and any transport issues. For what it's worth, I >> don't think this scaling back has meaningfully reduced my impact on the >> IETF. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> For most ADs, a much larger percentage of ballots have issues pertaining >> to their area of expertise. If I applied the same criteria to being SEC AD, >> I would probably be spending *at least* 40% of my time on balloting. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ******* >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> In summary, I'm spending about 25%-30% of my workweek on AD-specific >> stuff. When I started, it was over 50%. mostly because I was much more >> thorough on IESG ballots. An additional chunk of time is spent on being an >> IETF participant. Although I participate in more policy work than the bare >> minimum, I would say that this level of commitment is pretty close to a >> lower bound for competent* execution of the duties because: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> - Transport is small: few WGs, not that many documents, largely >> irrelevant to most IESG ballots >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> - I am experienced: I've formed an opinion about what matters and have >> stopped doing stuff that I don't think matters. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ******** >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Some closing thoughts: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> No one asked me, but I don't think eliminating AD tasks that take <5% of >> the week is going to make a difference in recruiting: it's still a matter >> of asking your manager to be removed from some dayjob tasks. The real money >> is in (1) eliminating lots of working groups; (2) having way more ADs; >> and/or (3) fundamentally changing the nature of IESG balloting. All of >> these have significant drawbacks. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> I will also note that we historically have plenty of AD candidates for >> some areas (SEC and RTG) and almost none in others (TSV). It is apparent to >> me that this is not just about workload and there are other factors at >> play, and the community would benefit from exploring these before taking a >> sledgehammer to the generic AD job description. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> WG management and AD Evaluation are the most important things I do and >> should not be abridged. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> If there's one place I regret not spending more time, it's adoption calls >> in my WGs. There are several instances where I have AD evaluated a document >> that isn't highly objectionable, but that I don't think is a particularly >> useful addition to the RFC series. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Martin Duke >> >> >> >> Transport AD 2020-2024 >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> * I have received private feedback that my contribution has been >> reasonably competent, but others are free to disagree, >> >>
- [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Martin Duke
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Warren Kumari
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Salz, Rich
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD S Moonesamy
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Roman Danyliw
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Warren Kumari
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Barry Leiba
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Eric Vyncke (evyncke)
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Warren Kumari
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Warren Kumari
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Salz, Rich
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Pengshuping (Peng Shuping)
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [Gendispatch] How I spend my time as an AD Warren Kumari