Re: [Hipsec] regarding IANA sections in bis documents

[Ben Campbell <[e-mail]>]

> On Jul 15, 2016, at 8:53 AM, Alexey Melnikov <[e-mail]> wrote:
> 
> Hi Julien,
> 
>> On 15 Jul 2016, at 02:17, Julien Laganier <[e-mail]> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Ben & Alexey,
>> 
>> Thanks for clarifying. We've discussed your suggestion with Terry
>> Manderson from IANA and have agreed on proceeding as follows:
>> 
>> RFCXXXX, obsoleted by this document, made the following IANA
>> allocation in <insert registry name>: <describe existing allocations>.
> 
> ... and the allocation policy.

Yes, that too.

> 
>> IANA is requested to replace references to [RFCXXXX] by references to
>> this document in the the <insert existing registry name> registry.
>> 
>> This document also requests IANA to make these additional <describe
>> new allocation> in <insert existing or new registry>".
>> 
>> If this is okay with you both I will proceed with updating
>> draft-ietf-hip-rfc520{3,4,5}-bis accordingly.
> 
> Sounds good to me.

Me, too.

Thanks!

Ben

> 
> Thank you,
> Alexey
>> 
>> Best,
>> 
>> --julien
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Fri, Jul 8, 2016 at 9:34 AM, Ben Campbell <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>> On 8 Jul 2016, at 10:53, Tom Henderson wrote:
>>> 
>>>>> On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 11:31 AM, Alexey Melnikov <[e-mail]>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Alexey Melnikov has entered the following ballot position for
>>>>>> draft-ietf-hip-rfc5204-bis-07: Discuss
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> DISCUSS:
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> The IANA considerations section does not seem to stand alone without
>>>>>> reading RFC 5204. As you are obsoleting RFC 5204, readers shouldn't be
>>>>>> expected to read it in order to discover original IANA instructions.
>>>>>> I think you should copy information from RFC 5204.
>>>> 
>>>>> On 07/08/2016 07:17 AM, Julien Laganier wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi Alexey,
>>>>> 
>>>>> The IANA Considerations used to be a copy of RFC 5204 but someone
>>>>> asked that it be cleaned up. I will copy it back in the next revision.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>> 
>>>>> --julien
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I was probably the person suggesting the current writeup, based on my
>>>> previous interaction with IANA regarding RFC 7401 publication.
>>>> 
>>>> Before making any IANA section changes, I would like to ask for further
>>>> clarification, because it seems to me that the guidance being given now
>>>> conflicts with instructions we received from IANA when revising RFC 5201 to
>>>> become RFC 7401.
>>>> 
>>>> When RFC 5201 was updated to RFC 7401, we originally followed the "copy
>>>> forward the IANA section" approach, but were told by IANA that they
>>>> preferred that we instead state the updates to be taken on existing
>>>> registries rather than repeating earlier actions that were already taken to
>>>> create the registries.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> In my opinion, you need both. The text needs to make it clear what actions
>>> IANA needs to take _now_. But it also needs to fully document any
>>> registries/registrations so that other readers can find it, keeping in mind
>>> that an obsoleted RFC is, well, obsolete. Note that this is usually at least
>>> somewhat different from simply copying the old text forward. This is
>>> especially true when updating the reference for a registry or registration
>>> to point to the bis document; this only makes sense if the bis draft
>>> actually describes that registry or registration.
>>> 
>>> I think it's perfectly reasonable to say something of the form of "RFCXXXX,
>>> obsoleted by this document, made these requests of IANA: <old-stuff>. This
>>> document mades these additional requests: <new-stuff>"
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> That led to the following revisions (where you can see, when using the
>>>> IETF rfcdiff tool, in version 14 it is a copy forward while version 15 it
>>>> updates the existing registries):
>>>> 
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-hip-rfc5201-bis-14.txt
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-hip-rfc5201-bis-15.txt
>>>> 
>>>> - Tom
>