Re: [homenet] Let's make in-home ULA presence a MUST !?

Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> Sat, 18 October 2014 04:25 UTC

Return-Path: <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: homenet@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: homenet@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 874731A0252 for <homenet@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 17 Oct 2014 21:25:32 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.006
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.006 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, PLING_QUERY=0.994, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ownncE7AMYIm for <homenet@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 17 Oct 2014 21:25:31 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pa0-x236.google.com (mail-pa0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c03::236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8CC811A0179 for <homenet@ietf.org>; Fri, 17 Oct 2014 21:25:31 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pa0-f54.google.com with SMTP id ey11so1918382pad.41 for <homenet@ietf.org>; Fri, 17 Oct 2014 21:25:31 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc :subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=eSMPfEMLaVLjeeEFoXWG565VASSJjZlNkyQKIwevFFc=; b=M//D69L0WFmnhtzX8ZrlFNseCdYzgVkn4hnPBf4vnKjAMJoUrO25i1GjmsBcVYx85n 94rT7oHOpW1wyz+bNBs49c5B13unTzeceuLgoTwpqHDLtHWdAmn/nVaHVD57GudQO0pd Qzj4DqccNqiSbE+/Fz3FkNeac73aWn1FFXAjHMsKvhiSoFYM0uNFf7HbnAZ6hHJN5TML F9j4Isd5ZN9ablpqS9urevC3SjSehE1ObRmPF3QCy61ATsR9gUk9NHpGLUqjdQ5CRHQW tywoZIYw9g5Rc4c600yoS/c0swmV37qzWI51B/icFxXGhC91WbBMwGxBAQN5tEUkYOSM 5gJg==
X-Received: by 10.70.38.232 with SMTP id j8mr13051101pdk.44.1413606331222; Fri, 17 Oct 2014 21:25:31 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [172.17.1.55] (219-89-120-188.adsl.xtra.co.nz. [219.89.120.188]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id ah2sm2921657pad.10.2014.10.17.21.25.27 for <multiple recipients> (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 17 Oct 2014 21:25:29 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <5441EBC2.30905@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2014 17:25:38 +1300
From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
Organization: University of Auckland
User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>
References: <72CC13D1-7E7A-4421-B23E-16D8FFAEEB58@darou.fr> <CAAedzxp1R-C5E9RJVMVLRJxPc0w4zooPtqnvWK9eggpZu4=xtg@mail.gmail.com> <alpine.DEB.2.02.1410141020360.30853@uplift.swm.pp.se> <C52D3324-3015-45E0-88CF-D2A778D246B8@iki.fi> <CADhXe52iH_Abh3iZvpgQQYJF_FzbKkhNwzwjkcDt-DJA3RL+VA@mail.gmail.com> <70C2B2B2-A19A-4730-AB51-1EF26448445B@fugue.com> <CADhXe533umX9Q3NSbEktjcj8mBatXkDmRQKz0hOkGriBSX0t4g@mail.gmail.com> <94990F79-439A-4820-B03B-BFEAB01AA515@fugue.com> <CADhXe50DoZjjoG5tfidcGgtXx1TFyYECZyzeWmQstsT3=HPyaA@mail.gmail.com> <0DACB967-C77F-4C8A-82DD-759FF5C39E91@fugue.com> <CADhXe51ya1bHnP8NCvNkuN1+xdhNnA3qnapn7h1XEvmDX2D_jg@mail.gmail.com> <4321EF22-4AD9-4BC8-8253-12034C562C00@fugue.com> <CADhXe51MC4ubB3de+sSm+KSRNQJH7RLVvRUWmQnE393RR+HBnA@mail.gmail.com> <69F7C62F-273B-4808-B7A8-5D2487CAF4BF@fugue.com>
In-Reply-To: <69F7C62F-273B-4808-B7A8-5D2487CAF4BF@fugue.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/homenet/7MQ4oif7Z4RRtovOLlMx1C4Dwhs
Cc: HOMENET Working Group <homenet@ietf.org>, James Woodyatt <jhw@nestlabs.com>
Subject: Re: [homenet] Let's make in-home ULA presence a MUST !?
X-BeenThere: homenet@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: <homenet.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/homenet>, <mailto:homenet-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/homenet/>
List-Post: <mailto:homenet@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:homenet-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/homenet>, <mailto:homenet-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2014 04:25:32 -0000

Ted,

On 18/10/2014 11:37, Ted Lemon wrote:
> On Oct 17, 2014, at 5:16 PM, James Woodyatt <jhw@nestlabs.com> wrote:
>> p1. It looks like you agree that locally generate ULA prefixes should be allowed to expire. What I don't see is any conceptual outline for deciding, in a distributed methodology, which prefixes to renew and which to release when their valid lifetime expires. Without seeing that, I can't agree that you've proposed anything that solves the problem I keep yammering about, much less offered a better solution than the one I proposed earlier in the thread.
> 
> Please don't put words in my mouth.
> 
> I did explain how to do that: before the network partitions, 

That seems to imply that you know in advance that the network
will partition. I assume that it will usually be a surprise.
Normally there is no human manager, although a human might
randomly disconnect cables or switch off a power socket.

So I think you mean: as soon as the network has generated its ULA...

> divide the ULA into 64k /64 prefixes, and distribute these evenly among attached routers.

...but that will break when another router attaches itself later,
unless the (re)distribution process is continuous.

>  Routers other than the ones that own a particular /64 are not allowed ever to use that /64 unless the router that owns it relinquishes it to them explicitly.

Sure, and this needs to be supported by HNCP (or something else).

>   Prior to partition, an agreement is made that one of the routers gets to keep the ULA in the event of a long-term partition. 

Again: that has to happen as soon as the ULA is generated, since partition
is unpredictable.

   Brian