Re: [HR-rt] Review Team Meeting `Notes IETF 104

Beatrice Martini <mail@beatricemartini.it> Sun, 24 March 2019 14:00 UTC

Return-Path: <mail@beatricemartini.it>
X-Original-To: hr-rt@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: hr-rt@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D14DC1277C9 for <hr-rt@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 24 Mar 2019 07:00:14 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.899
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=beatricemartini-it.20150623.gappssmtp.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y62ueL4rIqgL for <hr-rt@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 24 Mar 2019 07:00:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-it1-x136.google.com (mail-it1-x136.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::136]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A42DB12788C for <hr-rt@irtf.org>; Sun, 24 Mar 2019 07:00:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-it1-x136.google.com with SMTP id h9so10196857itl.1 for <hr-rt@irtf.org>; Sun, 24 Mar 2019 07:00:11 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=beatricemartini-it.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=H1Ary/imxndMnh89OVb4dR1vpCATci8BO4wmpCavN0Y=; b=qb4ZTWOG+FIF++rmHqoSj6yJmY+lEc/nVbb/qx57nfA6TAbRfz3KrCGeJnb/D6woHv cTcOG2WyUS5HBM2v+yTywzX3BmnIXXWfG9oRdBlnG44dwawJwqCNcSNQ8C1PuDHOEvyv a1kPl6cPd8NhtzZdGDrT3/8MZ4T8mXTy44hoChVzdrCyrhjmWNd2ai0uCyn+8Lyh6C4m zStieynaPJnYmNnm2ZiclIj56cYZzxuwfnEx5CyVE211OLETTMOC2tHG6+Ntfa2gwU4+ kbVkDRm0GfTkXZhWvVWqaTXF1nKUQIddJI/dL1mwiElqcLVnYjQiMi11LSPhK/mEZnsB yQWA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=H1Ary/imxndMnh89OVb4dR1vpCATci8BO4wmpCavN0Y=; b=HANkP/BZFmmZMGwF5jEtRX5C39DXiqoJ16BTNqKWKR5KWoU8XMNaCppfPmIeL5Pupe FZmg602Pv+tjlvrJCheTp7R9zlgO+NNUMpIGOkkzBySB+i6C3xuSzEqY59+mSz9wcmh6 3GJZEQl5WcdWIF2W4tjqdFmrNK9iTHy/8V0wnvoBu3qmllqm1sKtWfqMBEWMzvvYxpM/ +YY6uxy2n5hgOl2biAGCUNMTDAxx2pPrvrhD6IsaI5NkyLT68WUmsTmjCbrRfL+WybKy 8NtMExsT3AaEEh/dEe0E/cLkhPY/72MwPtHWgSItOdkz2mhOLaR5iPkFyCwMcUUCbUL0 VxMw==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXUkEfptL1t09av4Joeys3erhmsqDD83WHtaS6QfhAXS5tJR6PD Xfg24vZmL1RJz2JHCZK58+pm/Ov0+9gAbHkxu7TNsw==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqxqG375TctSxpp5xuRY55+bmHsGTilW9xaFLH+Sx2tGoFt9TFrkSQrlhGGwMSbz92r2GzAtLqFU/xqdunRlX1U=
X-Received: by 2002:a02:3806:: with SMTP id b6mr14139951jaa.60.1553436010700; Sun, 24 Mar 2019 07:00:10 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <CAD499eKF-c=djTi+-yZJFFkes8XdEtcb1WK8RYVM10GTpU6=bQ@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAD499eKF-c=djTi+-yZJFFkes8XdEtcb1WK8RYVM10GTpU6=bQ@mail.gmail.com>
From: Beatrice Martini <mail@beatricemartini.it>
Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2019 14:59:54 +0100
Message-ID: <CA+0Hr7uhdDdF9f4o=g4i7Woc94iHA5TbCO89QYG_508mPWy61Q@mail.gmail.com>
To: Corinne Cath <corinnecath@gmail.com>
Cc: hr-rt@irtf.org
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000997bac0584d7815d"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/hr-rt/xTnhurb4L-faTWHYIvqA0_goGAA>
Subject: Re: [HR-rt] Review Team Meeting `Notes IETF 104
X-BeenThere: hr-rt@irtf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Human Rights Protocol Considerations Review Team <hr-rt.irtf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/options/hr-rt>, <mailto:hr-rt-request@irtf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/hr-rt/>
List-Post: <mailto:hr-rt@irtf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:hr-rt-request@irtf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hr-rt>, <mailto:hr-rt-request@irtf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 24 Mar 2019 14:00:15 -0000

Hi Corinne and all,

Thank you very much for the discussions and notes taken and shared!

> Maybe we should do a debrief after this week, also keeping in mind that
we are putting in new grants for this work.

This sounds like a very good idea, indeed.

Thanks again! Looking forward to discussing further.

Best,
Beatrice

On Sun, Mar 24, 2019 at 12:08 PM Corinne Cath <corinnecath@gmail.com>; wrote:

> Dear all,
>
> Please find below my rough draft of the notes I took during the Review
> Team meeting this morning.
>
> Let me know if anything is unclear.
>
>
>
> Human Right Review Team:
>
>
>
> -       Has been contentious
>
> -       Has put HRPC at risk
>
> -       How to develop, two strategies below:
>
>
>
> MK:
>
>
>
> Strategy one:
>
> Maybe we need to change the model and be working more WG based
>
> We go into working groups and review from within
>
> Reviews do need to be documented in one place, it can be tracked and
> followed via interventions in drafts. Doesn't have to be separate documents.
>
> We need to make the work more in line with how the WGs work.
>
>
>
> Strategy two:
>
> Sometimes it’s good to parachute in because at the end of a process the
> authors might have difficulties seeing certain issues.
>
> These two approaches are a bit difficult to combine (embed + parachute in)
> – but if we pair folks up, it might work.
>
>
>
> MK:
>
> Maybe a review like that could have been a blog? Because it is interesting
> but perhaps less suitable for a WG discussion.
>
>
>
> AA:
>
> We need to think about how the HRPC developments reflect on our
> organizations
>
>
>
> MK:
>
> People talked to us about like we were a directorate, but we have course
> corrected and been quieter in the approach. Maybe we need to change the
> metrics, we know much more now about how we can be effective in this work.
>
>
>
> CCS:
>
> How do you know where to work?
>
> What do you do with it? How do we work with 8280? How do we know how to
> iterate on our work?
>
>
>
> MK:
>
> Good question, I have some more questions in response:
>
> Is it ability based?
>
> Is it this group-is-on-fire-based?
>
> Not sure I have all the answers to this.
>
>
>
> Maybe we need to reverse map from 8280 to all the different WG and go from
> there? CDT has a thing like that, maybe we ask to see it and work from
> that?
>
>
>
> SS:
>
> We shouldn’t just restrict that to IETF, this is also an issue for IEEE
> etc.
>
> Sounds like a lot of work though
>
>
>
> MK: review team next steps
>
> Karan +GG finish current reviews
>
> Scoping and mapping that can be done for work going forward
>
> How do we share information about reviews
>
>
>
> KS:
>
> Responses are a good one for metrics
>
>
>
> GG:
>
> Uploaded a new version of the guidelines document
>
> If reviews are done in an embedded way, how do we feed that back to the
> guidelines
>
>
>
> MK:
>
> We also need to see whether RFC8280 makes sense based on the feedback we
> get
>
> We raised a lot of questions
>
> Bangkok was a difficult meeting – have we sufficiently regrouped?
>
>
>
> Which WGs people are in currently:
>
> TLS (fellow)
>
> REGEX (GG)
>
> CAPORT (GG + MK0
>
> Dots (MK)
>
> MLS (SS + nat + dkg)
>
> GAIA (MK + CCS)
>
> Quic (SS + CCS)
>
> DinRG (SS)
>
> PearG (SS + CCS)
>
> DNSop (KS)
>
> SMART (SS)
>
> IPWave (AA)
>
> IASA (CCS)
>
> SecDispatch (SS)
>
> DOH (GG)
>
>
>
> Maybe we should do a debrief after this week, also keeping in mind that we
> are putting in new grants for this work.
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
> --
> Corinne Cath - Speth
> Ph.D. Candidate, Oxford Internet Institute & Alan Turing Institute
>
> Web: www.oii.ox.ac.uk/people/corinne-cath
> <http://www.oii..ox.ac.uk/people/corinne-cath>
> Email: ccath@turing.ac.uk & corinnecath@gmail.com
> Twitter: @C_Cath
> _______________________________________________
> HR-rt mailing list
> HR-rt@irtf.org
> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hr-rt
>


-- 
Beatrice Martini
Twitter <https://twitter.com/beatricemartini> / Blog
<http://beatricemartini.it/blog/> / Newsletter <http://eepurl.com/bbDuEn>