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Thu, 23 Jul 2026 04:47:22 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <458617591.673.1784580561240@appsuite.open-xchange.com> In-Reply-To: From: Corinne Cath Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2026 13:46:45 +0200 X-Gm-Features: AUfX_mytGMPv42sWmmIBOl2P6FW29WHGUmPN6GkYyNOICkRG5jLaCY4LnFNAD1U Message-ID: To: avri doria Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000a85522065745d1d1" Message-ID-Hash: VLAMR7FDDYTHDJ5YMZT5UAOT2UUWYBNV X-Message-ID-Hash: VLAMR7FDDYTHDJ5YMZT5UAOT2UUWYBNV X-MailFrom: cattekwaad@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-hrpc.irtf.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.9rc6 Precedence: list Subject: =?utf-8?q?=5Bhrpc=5D_Re=3A_Slides_Vienna_talk_today_on_Cloud_computing_and_I?= =?utf-8?q?nternet_governance_resilience?= List-Id: hrpc discussion list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --000000000000a85522065745d1d1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The hollowing out happens in many different ways, not just limited to the examples of the loss of technical expertise, control over core operations, changes in organizational culture, and budget realignment that i mentioned in my talk (see also page 17-18 of my slides). I think the talk should be online in the next couple of days. I would also highly recommend having a look at the work of the programmable infrastructures project at the university of delft, and its recent research outputs--my post doc work is based on their theoretical framing, and i think they make that argument around how the cloud hollows out the organizations that become reliant on it very eloquently: - https://www.tudelft.nl/tbm/onze-faculteit/afdelingen/multi-actor-systems= /onderzoek/projects/programmable-infrastructures-project - Big Tech Capturing our healthcare system: https://www.tudelft.nl/2022/tbm/how-big-tech-captured-our-public-health-= system - Bertulfo, D. J., & G=C3=BCrses, S. (2026). Engineering infrastructural power over software production: The case of software-as-a-service. *Information, Communication & Society*, 1=E2=80=9318. https://doi.org/10.1080/1369118X.2026.2676635 - G=C3=BCrses, S., & Chander, S. (2024, October 15). V. From Infrastruct= ural Power to Redistribution: How the EU=E2=80=99s Digital Agenda Cements Sec= uritization and Computational Infrastructures (and How We Build Otherwise). *AI Now Institute*. https://ainowinstitute.org/publications/from-infrastructural-power-to-re= distribution-how-the-eus-digital-agenda-cements-securitization-and-computat= ional-infrastructures-and-how-we-build-otherwise - Balayn, A., & G=C3=BCrses, S. (2025). *Regulations for Pigs Biting AI infrastructures=E2=81=89 A case for empirically studying AI production t= o inform and enrich AI governance*. https://chi-staig.github.io/papers/submission20.pdf - Gend, T. van, Bertulfo, D. J., & G=C3=BCrses, S. (2024). *The PET Para= dox: How Amazon Instrumentalises PETs in Sidewalk to Entrench Its Infrastructural Power* (arXiv:2412.09994). arXiv. https://doi.org/10.48550/arXiv.2412.09994 Warmly, corinne - - On Tue, Jul 21, 2026 at 3:22=E2=80=AFPM avri doria wr= ote: - Hi, - - I listened to the talk, but perhaps have to listen again. I do not - understand the notion of "hollowing out" nor do in understand the - mechanism by which it is done when moving from self/local providers to - the global corporations. While I am not particularly fond myself of the - corporate imperative for ever greater profit, I do not understand how - that changes the priorities of the client. Can the clients no longer - exert pressure on their providers. Can't they mitigate the effect. I - know returning to local providers or doing their own is difficult, but - blending the two should be possible to keep from being overrun by the - "foreign"imperatives. - - On 7/21/2026 05:45, Corinne Cath wrote: - > but that they are particular types of big and driven by a set of - > commercial priorities that hollow out the public institutions that - > come to rely on them. - - Are there ways to mitigate these effects other than never moving their - operations to the cloud. Is it analogous to the effects of addiction? - - - As I said, perhaps I need to listen again. - - - avri - - _______________________________________________ - hrpc mailing list -- hrpc@irtf.org - To unsubscribe send an email to hrpc-leave@irtf.org - - - -- - Dr. Corinne Cath - Research Affiliate at the University of Cambridge, Minderoo Centre for Technology & Democracy - *Bluesky: ccs.bsky.social* - *Mastodon: @C__CS@someone.elses.computer * - *W: www.corinnecath.com / www.pitg.network * --000000000000a85522065745d1d1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<= span style=3D"font-family:tahoma,sans-serif;background-color:transparent">T= he hollowing out happens in many different ways, not just limited to the ex= amples of the loss of technical expertise, control over core operations, ch= anges in organizational culture, and budget realignment that i mentioned in= my talk (see also page 17-18 of my slides). I think the talk should be onl= ine in the next couple of days.=C2=A0

I w= ould also highly recommend having a look at the work of the programmable in= frastructures project at the university of delft, and its recent research o= utputs--my post doc work is based on their theoretical framing, and i think= they make that argument around how the cloud hollows out the organizations= that become reliant on it very eloquently:=C2=A0
Warmly, corinne=C2=A0


  • On Tue, Jul 21, 2026 at 3:22=E2=80=AFPM avri doria <<= a href=3D"mailto:avri@doria.org">avri@doria.org> wrote:
    • <= li>Hi,

  • I listened to the talk, but perhaps have to listen again. I do not <= /li>
  • understand the notion of "hollowing out" nor do in understand the=
  • mechanism by which it is done when moving from self/local providers to
  • the global corporations. While I am not particularly fond myself of the
  • corporate imperative for ever greater profit, I do not understand how
  • that changes the priorities of the client. Can the clients no longer
  • exert pressure on their providers. Can't they mitigate the effect. I
  • know returning to local providers or doing their own is difficult, but
  • blending the two should be possible to keep from being overrun by the
  • "foreign"imperatives.

  • On 7/21/2026 05:45, Corinne Cath wrote:
  • > but that they are particular types of big and driven by a set of
  • > commercial priorities that hollow out the public institutions that
  • > come to rely on them.
  • Are there ways to mitigate these effects other than never moving their
  • operations to the cloud. Is it analogous to the effects of addiction?


  • As I said, perhaps I need to listen again.


  • =
  • avri

  • <= font face=3D"tahoma, sans-serif"> _______________________________________________
  • hrpc mailing list -- hrp= c@irtf.org
  • To unsubscribe send an email to hrpc-leave@irtf.org


  • --
  • Dr. Corinne Cath=C2=A0
  • Research Affiliate at the Uni= versity of Cambridge, Minderoo Centre for Technology & Democracy=C2=A0= =C2=A0
  • Bluesky: = ccs.bsky.social
  • Mas= todon: @C__CS@someone.elses.computer=C2=A0
  • W: www.corinnecath.com / www.pitg.network=C2=A0
    • --000000000000a85522065745d1d1--