Re: [hrpc] re history lessons

Sandra Braman <braman@tamu.edu> Mon, 03 May 2021 15:59 UTC

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From: Sandra Braman <braman@tamu.edu>
Date: Mon, 03 May 2021 10:59:03 -0500
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To: Gurshabad Grover <gurshabad@cis-india.org>
Cc: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>, Mallory Knodel <mknodel@cdt.org>, hrpc@irtf.org
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Subject: Re: [hrpc] re history lessons
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Thanks yet again, Gurshabad. So not an undoable list of drafts (7), and
only the one RFC, as of 5 months ago. Appreciated.

On Mon, May 3, 2021 at 10:40 AM Gurshabad Grover <gurshabad@cis-india.org>
wrote:

> To my knowledge, all RFCs and I-Ds that have a human rights
> considerations section (up until a while ago, at least) are listed here:
>
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://github.com/IRTF-HRPC/reviews/blob/main/drafts_RFCs_with_HRCs.md__;!!KwNVnqRv!QL458dtCkoJWt0Gd3bE850O8FEeq61n9zhqLSRUEkrkgOMzP-81bK1e3iWZ9XQ$
>
> (RFC8492 is the one that pokes fun at the section and links it to the
> right to bear arms).
>
> -Gurshabad
>
> On 5/3/21 8:49 PM, Ted Lemon wrote:
> > Which rfc is on the right to bear arms?
> >
> >> On May 3, 2021, at 11:16, Sandra Braman <braman@tamu.edu> wrote:
> >>
> >> 
> >> Appreciate this, Mallory.  Our interpretations of the effects of
> >> particular activities may reasonably differ, but you are also
> >> assigning meaning to my comment that was not there. I did not say I
> >> was discounting the code 451 effort, although you and I may disagree
> >> regarding what the nature of its consequences are.
> >>
> >> I have so far looked only at RFCs for mention of 8280; there is just
> >> the one. Would appreciate it if others could point me to Internet
> >> drafts that do. Was fascinated to see that the only RFC mentioning
> >> 8280 does so by focusing on the right to bear arms.
> >>
> >> I agree with you that it would be a great research project for someone
> >> to analyze discussions of drafts that do mention human rights
> >> considerations, and what the reasons were for not ultimately including
> >> that section in documents ultimately published. Actually, that could
> >> be useful as input into future HRPC efforts.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, May 3, 2021 at 9:53 AM Mallory Knodel <mknodel@cdt.org
> >> <mailto:mknodel@cdt.org>> wrote:
> >>
> >>     Hi Sandra,
> >>
> >>     It would be incorrect to minimise the impact of RFC 8280 and HRPC
> >>     this way, Sandra.
> >>
> >>     The fact that 451 isn't as technically implementable as authors
> >>     envisioned is orthogonal to its human rights considerations. It
> >>     shouldn't be discounted.
> >>
> >>     I believe there are more RFCs and I-D that directly cite a human
> >>     rights consideration, but others might chime in on which
> specifically.
> >>
> >>     It also won't include the ways in which people engage in draft
> >>     reviews with human rights considerations influenced by RFC 8280.
> >>     Harder to measure, but still worth doing.
> >>
> >>     -Mallory
> >>
> >>     On 5/3/21 10:43 AM, Sandra Braman wrote:
> >>>     Point taken, Niels, re the archive -- have read most of it but
> >>>     will ensure it is all read and reviewed for its attention to this
> >>>     particular question; will return to the list if questions remain.
> >>>
> >>>     Another, if I may -- It turns out, according to Mallory and
> >>>     others, code 451 has not actually been useful. What do members of
> >>>     this group make out of the fact that only one RFC since
> >>>     publication of 8280 has addressed human rights considerations,
> >>>     and that was the right to bear arms?  Is it expected that
> >>>     publication of the guidelines document currently in progress will
> >>>     make a difference?  Any advice regarding where I can turn for
> >>>     explanations of this?
> >>>
> >>>     Thanks again --
> >>>
> >>>     Sandra
> >>>
> >>>     _______________________________________________
> >>>     hrpc mailing list
> >>>     hrpc@irtf.org <mailto:hrpc@irtf.org>
> >>>
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> >
> >>
> >>     --
> >>     Mallory Knodel
> >>     CTO, Center for Democracy and Technology
> >>     gpg fingerprint :: E3EB 63E0 65A3 B240 BCD9 B071 0C32 A271 BD3C C780
> >>
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