Re: Upgrade, hmmm...

Nick Harper <nharper@google.com> Sat, 01 August 2020 00:34 UTC

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In-Reply-To: <173a76def4b.c5d7089c55482.3290597986042746664@zoho.com>
From: Nick Harper <nharper@google.com>
Date: Fri, 31 Jul 2020 17:33:48 -0700
Message-ID: <CACdeXiLFhJSUwS9bSfbFtuoKdw+Pb=hLO6Z2t71b_pf66cNPPA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Eric J Bowman <mellowmutt@zoho.com>
Cc: Ietf Http Wg <ietf-http-wg@w3.org>
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Subject: Re: Upgrade, hmmm...
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This isn't just my interpretation of Upgrade, it is how it is defined in
RFC 7230, section 6.7.

If you want to say "I also support these other protocols", check out
Alt-Svc (RFC 7838).

On Fri, Jul 31, 2020 at 5:31 PM Eric J Bowman <mellowmutt@zoho.com> wrote:

> Not how current browsers work, no. But, a client asking for that upgrade
> and getting an affirmative response via TCP, can feel free to repeat the
> request via UDP. At the cost of a round-trip. I'm taking under
> consideration your interpretation of Upgrade as being meant for the same
> connection, my way would be a different connection, you're right. What's
> the downside?
>
> -Eric
>
> (sorry for the double-post if I forgot to reply all, oops)
>
> ---- On Fri, 31 Jul 2020 16:59:20 -0700 *Nick Harper <nharper@google.com
> <nharper@google.com>>* wrote ----
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 31, 2020 at 4:51 PM Eric J Bowman <mellowmutt@zoho.com> wrote:
>
> Please refer me to previous discussions about why h2 and h2c, but no h1,
> h1c, or h3.
>
> I'm coding a webserver from scratch, with the goal of serving an
> index.html file and its ancillaries, over any of HTTP/1.1, HTTP/2, HTTP/3,
> FTP, WAKA (if Roy ever publishes it), or "ERIC" because I have my own
> ideas. Encrypted or not (I realize "not" isn't an option with HTTP/3). So
> the main loop is protocol-negotiation hell worse than any conneg/langneg
> I've ever coded.
>
> If I'm hosting multiple websites on my service, I might want to default to
> h2, at this time. But if one of those client websites is a law firm, they
> don't care about serving legal definitions over "h1c" to incarcerated
> clients, who aren't allowed to use encryption unless it's attorney-client
> privileged communication. So, how does a gateway at the prison wall connect
> using h2 but request "Downgrade: h1c"? Or maybe there could be a "Protocol"
> header with a weighted list (lol).
>
> (Taking a presentation I watched on YouTube by PHK, to heart -- some
> sovereign states disallow encryption, and heck, America's own FBI wants to
> kill it. But I agree it's important to be able to downgrade to cleartext.)
>
> Or, why can't an h2c connection request Upgrade: h3? Coding my webserver
> to shift those gears, turns out to be trivial, all things considered at
> this point. So, why are only h2/h2c standardized as Upgrade tokens?
>
>
> The Upgrade header is used to suggest switching protocols on the *same*
> connection. Given that an h2 (or h2c) connection runs on TCP and HTTP/3
> runs on UDP, there's no way to upgrade the existing connection to HTTP/3.
>
>
>
> -Eric
>
>
>
>
>