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I don't think it makes sense to add a dependency on the Capsule Protocol he= re, given the significant additional complexity and (at present) zero added= value.  If the Capsule Protocol becomes relevant, future implementati= ons can negotiate it via the Capsule-Protocol header field.

As an example of the complexity, note that all uses of the Capsule Protocol= to date are "atomic": each capsule is expected to be buffered an= d processed as a whole.  In this thread we've heard proposals to intro= duce new capsule types that the recipient must process in "streaming" fashion.  This mix of atomic and str= eaming capsules is a new wrinkle in the Capsule Protocol.

Regarding multiple IPs: adding this capability later is difficult because w= e do not have a well-defined extension mechanism (unless we are willing to = derive capabilities from the template's variable names).  The extensib= ility problem also applies when considering retrofitting this capability to Connect-UDP (in addition to some other pro= blems specific to UDP).

--Ben
From: Lucas Pardue <luca= spardue.24.7@gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 6, 2024 6:32 PM
To: David Schinazi <dschinazi.ietf@gmail.com>
Cc: Tommy Pauly <tpauly@apple.com>; Ben Schwartz <bemasc@me= ta.com>; HTTP Working Group <ietf-http-wg@w3.org>
Subject: Re: WGLC for draft-ietf-httpbis-connect-tcp
 
On Wed, 6 Mar 2024, 23:=E2=80=8A15 David Schinazi, <dschinazi.=E2=80=8Ai= etf@=E2=80=8Agmail.=E2=80=8Acom> wrote: First, to respond to Tommy's cha= ir comment about WGLC: I absolutely agree this needs more review.= Additionally, I think we should wait for implementation


On Wed, 6 Mar 2024, 23:15 David Sch= inazi, <dschinazi.ietf@gmail= .com> wrote:
First, to respond to Tommy's chair comment about WGLC: I absolutely ag= ree this needs more review. Additionally, I think we should wait = for implementation experience before sending it to the IESG.

Now, to respond to Tommy's technical points as individual:

When we originally developed the capsule protocol, I was worried about the = consequences of taking over the data stream. Luckily, there's a straightfor= ward solution: we define a DATA capsule - the semantics of all DATA capsule= s is that they are concatenated to create the DATA stream. That would allow us to have message conten= t ("body") with methods that rely on the capsule protocol.

I hadn't really thought about it in the context of connect-tcp, but I = like that idea. We could say that connect-tcp always uses the capsule proto= col, and then uses DATA capsules to encode the CONNECT/TCP bytestream. It's= a little bit more code on the receiver, and pretty much none on the sender (just send a DATA capsule with length= =3D2^61).

I think what you're saying is DATA capsules could be used= to provide agility in whether implementations interleave Capsules or not.&= nbsp;

A common concern I hear is that any level of framing risk= s losing an ability to "splice" the post-CONNECT data stream onto= a consumer. That reduces performance compared to classic CONNECT. I think = using a large DATA capsule adds trivial overhead before deciding if a splice is OK or not - implementations already have to= read HEADERS before switching to that mode.

The nice property of allowing other capsules before switc= hing into a large DATA, is that it could allow for custom capsule types to = exchange metadata that doesn't fit well in CONNECT-associated headers. For = instance, some binary blob that is larger than typical header size limits on the Internet. 

Cheers
Lucas
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